Has Royle lost the plot?

ippers · Post by **ippers** » Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:49 pm

Right before start moaning about this im not particulary criticising Royle here just interested to see peoples opinions. For example he says 'judge us when we have our players fit' we did tonight and at Coventry basically and the performance 2nite made that comment look particulary stupid and 'we have had a decent start to the season' but what about he likes of Derby, Watford, Norwich ,Preston, Burnley we have failed to beat the only teams we have beat are Crewe, Plymouth, Millwall, Sheffield wed (possibly the 4 worst teams in the league) with the exception of Leeds. Its hard to deny he has done a good job since hes been here but do ppl think he has lost the plot somewhat with his signings selections tactics etc this season?

Mork · Post by **Mork** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 3:01 am

Yup.

With some of the stuff he's said over the past few months, he's going to come mightily undone now - and lose both the fans and the players confidence.

Our "best team" looks mightily suspect, has the same defensive frailities that we've had ever since Royle arrived, and our lone striker, cannot score goals - dont wanna get on the lads back, and I'll support him on the pitch, but he ain't up to the task.

the-mole · Post by **the-mole** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:54 am

Couldn't make it last night - but my dad gave me a full run down of the side on the way to work this morning - pretty much his only comment was - sh*t (sorry for swearing)!!

Our best performance of the season was against Sheff Wed. That game we had a team full of youth players, all competing with style and class. Even bowditch had a decent game in which he was playing as a main striker (something not in tune with his game).

Now for whatever reason Royle is intent on not playing some of the highly talented youth we have at the club. Our best chance of winning games doesn't include the likes of Magilton, Currie and Horlock. Add De Vos to the list and for most of the season we have been carrying 4 players.

Currie only puts in a performance when he is surrounded by younger players - so if we need an old git in midfield play currie and stick some youthful legs around him.

I can't believe people still talk about us playing decent football - you can count on one hand how often we have played decent footy this season. We have been terrible, can't create opportunities for love nor money. Royle has had enough time to sort out our poor defence. We have seen alot of players come in to shore things up - all have failed.

Has Royle lost the plot - think it is fair to say he dam sure has. On paper I still believe we have a decent enough squad for this division, however we need to be competing and giving 100% all the time. We have no shape and no real balance in the side. Regardless of financial problems or injuries - this is Joes job to get right.

I think it is only fair to give him til the end of the season - then if things have not improved it is time for a new man. Bloody stupid thing is that idiot Sheepshanks has tied him down to a bigger more lucrative contract - a.k.a. Burley all over again!!!

nieros · Post by **nieros** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:16 am

Personaly I think he has written this season off and is determined not to let any of the youngsters play as they will get pouched at the end of the season by bigger clubs.

Imho.

Post by **Dazza** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:23 am

I dont think JR has lost the plot, because saying things like "we can make top 6" and "judge us when all our players are fit" are the things you HAVE to say as a manger. Can you imagine what we'd say if he went "we'll be lucky to hit mid-table" or "even with our best players fit we'll get thrashed". Us fans would go mental, calling for his name. He has to appear to have this blind faith to create confidence.

I'm a massive JR fan, I think he has done a fantastic year with resoruces being stripped from here year are year but maybe it is the time for a new manager, We're not going to be up there next year as everyone suggests. The older players will be even older and slower and the younger players arent good enough to come in and make the difference. If JR wants to stay another 5 years then keep him on, but I cant see him wanting to do that, so lets get a young proven manager in who's good with youngsters and plan for the next 5 years. (thats if we make it as a club)

Susie · Post by **Susie** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:28 am

I have always been 100% behind Joe but I have to admit that for the last few games, he seems to have lost it.

He insists that he is playing our 'best team' but how could he possibly start last night with just Parkin up front. There wasn't a hope in hell of us scoring. De Vos should not be in the starting line up at the moment as he is making stupid mistakes constantly. He also needs to make his mind up where to play Richards.

We all knew that Reading was going to be a tough game but they were really taking the p*ss last night.

Mork · Post by **Mork** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:41 am

Dazza wrote:I dont think JR has lost the plot, because saying things like "we can make top 6" and "judge us when all our players are fit" are the things you HAVE to say as a manger. Can you imagine what we'd say if he went "we'll be lucky to hit mid-table" or "even with our best players fit we'll get thrashed". Us fans would go mental, calling for his name. He has to appear to have this blind faith to create confidence.

I'm a massive JR fan, I think he has done a fantastic year with resoruces being stripped from here year are year but maybe it is the time for a new manager, We're not going to be up there next year as everyone suggests. The older players will be even older and slower and the younger players arent good enough to come in and make the difference. If JR wants to stay another 5 years then keep him on, but I cant see him wanting to do that, so lets get a young proven manager in who's good with youngsters and plan for the next 5 years. (thats if we make it as a club)

Yeah, great post - gets my vote. If we could bring in a new guy now, and played all our young talent through to the end of the season, it'd be an improvement on now - even if the results are inconsistent and we dont finish top half.

Royle, thanks muchly. Time to move along, nothing to see here.

Mork · Post by **Mork** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:41 am

Dazza wrote:I dont think JR has lost the plot, because saying things like "we can make top 6" and "judge us when all our players are fit" are the things you HAVE to say as a manger. Can you imagine what we'd say if he went "we'll be lucky to hit mid-table" or "even with our best players fit we'll get thrashed". Us fans would go mental, calling for his name. He has to appear to have this blind faith to create confidence.

I'm a massive JR fan, I think he has done a fantastic year with resoruces being stripped from here year are year but maybe it is the time for a new manager, We're not going to be up there next year as everyone suggests. The older players will be even older and slower and the younger players arent good enough to come in and make the difference. If JR wants to stay another 5 years then keep him on, but I cant see him wanting to do that, so lets get a young proven manager in who's good with youngsters and plan for the next 5 years. (thats if we make it as a club)

Yeah, great post - gets my vote. If we could bring in a new guy now, and played all our young talent through to the end of the season, it'd be an improvement on now - even if the results are inconsistent and we dont finish top half.

Royle, thanks muchly. Time to move along, nothing to see here.

Ojc · Post by **Ojc** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:02 am

Wilnis and Naylor as the centre backs

Forster and Proudlock up front

Currie, Westlake, Juan, Richards/Willams in midfield, if we need a injection of pace on the flanks bring on Peters, if we need to keep hold of a 1-0 lead bring on Jim to calm things down and keep hold of the ball. Its not rocket science.

Its not difficult Joe, Parkin is/was a duff buy I have lost my patience altogether with him now, donkey.

Bluebird · Post by **Bluebird** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:16 am

Dazza wrote:I dont think JR has lost the plot, because saying things like "we can make top 6" and "judge us when all our players are fit" are the things you HAVE to say as a manger. Can you imagine what we'd say if he went "we'll be lucky to hit mid-table" or "even with our best players fit we'll get thrashed". Us fans would go mental, calling for his name. He has to appear to have this blind faith to create confidence.

I'm a massive JR fan, I think he has done a fantastic year with resoruces being stripped from here year are year but maybe it is the time for a new manager, We're not going to be up there next year as everyone suggests. The older players will be even older and slower and the younger players arent good enough to come in and make the difference. If JR wants to stay another 5 years then keep him on, but I cant see him wanting to do that, so lets get a young proven manager in who's good with youngsters and plan for the next 5 years. (thats if we make it as a club)

Fair points, well made.

I'm finally starting to lose faith in Joe, because of his team selections, tactics, and the lack of discipline and effort shown by his team!

If we are to be honest, we all knew we would get beat last night, but FFS at least let them know they've been in a game! Reading are not that good taht we should play one up front at home, did Royle learn nothing from Preston?

However, I can accept that we lost to a better side, I can accept that we are not good enough, but where is the passion? Why do we just simply roll over without a wimper? At least have a go, at least kick the fuckers and let them know they've been in a game of football.

We have been too weak for three years now, and we have been indiciplined and unprofessional at the back for the same period. This was covered up in the previous two season because we were so good going forward. But now we aren't, so the manager must ensure that his side, gives 100%, does the basics professionaly, and play with passion, discipline and show some guts!

If Joe is incapable of achieving these basic requirements from his players, then he should move on.

essexgirl · Post by **essexgirl** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:28 am

Problem is though I cannot see JR just walking. We don't have the funds to pay him off and therefore I can't see things changing on the managerial front at this time.

hallamblue · Post by **hallamblue** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:47 am

yes we have youth with talent at Ipswich (I'm talking about players like Peters, MacDonald. Garvan, Bowditch) ...but could they perform at the required level week in / out for the rest of the season ? I doubt it very much.

JR has nothing to work with in terms of "young , mid twenties" players in key areas, namely midfield and defence. I know he's seen as not giving these players their chance - but the alternative is to bung them in at the deep end and watch them get overpowered week in / out ..and then demoralised and losing thier confidence. Frankly if half of us stood next to these young players in the street we would refer to them as "kids" which is what they are ...and they would be expected to play week in / out against MEN with far more experience and physical strength !

This is a transitional season (s), & always has been - and the temptation to sacrifice some of these kids by chucking them in the first team in an effort to emulate last seasons squad is IMHO a "no go".

All things considered Joe is actually doing a very good job ! He may make tactical errors ( he is human after all!)...but he can only work with what the Board has given him !!

Post by **Earl Blue** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:56 am

hallamblue wrote:yes we have youth with talent at Ipswich (I'm talking about players like Peters, MacDonald. Garvan, Bowditch) ...but could they perform at the required level week in / out for the rest of the season ? I doubt it very much.
JR has nothing to work with in terms of "young , mid twenties" players in key areas, namely midfield and defence. I know he's seen as not giving these players their chance - but the alternative is to bung them in at the deep end and watch them get overpowered week in / out ..and then demoralised and losing thier confidence. Frankly if half of us stood next to these young players in the street we would refer to them as "kids" which is what they are ...and they would be expected to play week in / out against MEN with far more experience and physical strength !

This is a transitional season (s), & always has been - and the temptation to sacrifice some of these kids by chucking them in the first team in an effort to emulate last seasons squad is IMHO a "no go".

All things considered Joe is actually doing a very good job ! He may make tactical errors ( he is human after all!)...but he can only work with what the Board has given him !!

Do you think under Royle they will ever be given the chance.

toby · Post by **toby** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:17 am

This obsession with "experience" isn't working though is it?

Why aren't Garvan, McDonald, Peters etc getting extended run outs, give them 4 or 5 matches IN A ROW to see if they are going to cut or not?

We are now in a really sh*t position where we have no scope for failure, where as a few games back we could've put in some youngster without having to nervously look over our shoulders.

I hate to say this but as an outsider, having been to very few matches, we look in an absolute mess, the experienced guys aren't cutting it and the new players don't have the experience to get us out of the smelly stuff...a real catch 22 situation.

We really do need a revolution of some sort (manager, board or playing staff) to shake things up and to stir us out of this pathetic apathy that the club is in right now.

Post by **Earl Blue** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:23 am

toby wrote:This obsession with "experience" isn't working though is it?

Why aren't Garvan, McDonald, Peters etc getting extended run outs, give them 4 or 5 matches IN A ROW to see if they are going to cut or not?

We are now in a really sh*t position where we have no scope for failure, where as a few games back we could've put in some youngster without having to nervously look over our shoulders.

I hate to say this but as an outsider, having been to very few matches, we look in an absolute mess, the experienced guys aren't cutting it and the new players don't have the experience to get us out of the smelly stuff...a real catch 22 situation.

We really do need a revolution of some sort (manager, board or playing staff) to shake things up and to stir us out of this pathetic apathy that the club is in right now.

I totally agree Toby, I believe the youngsters will at least have a go and gain the valuble experience needed for next season.. OR are we
gonna continue to hear RIDICULOUS statements like we are
AFRAID if there potential is seen bigger clubs will come in for them..

Post by **Dazza** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:48 am

Ojc wrote:Its not difficult Joe, Parkin is/was a duff buy I have lost my patience altogether with him now, donkey.

Ipswich fans didnt take to Pablo when he first came, but look how good he got and also look at Kuqi, he was rubbish and everyone REALLY slated him, but everyone said he was our best player last season.

I know he is crap, wont stick up for him on that front, but he could get better!

I guess he is our top goal scorer, so is he a waste? Discuss... lol

Post by **Earl Blue** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:55 am

Dazza wrote:
Ojc wrote:Its not difficult Joe, Parkin is/was a duff buy I have lost my patience altogether with him now, donkey.
Ipswich fans didnt take to Pablo when he first came, but look how good he got and also look at Kuqi, he was rubbish and everyone REALLY slated him, but everyone said he was our best player last season.

I know he is crap, wont stick up for him on that front, but he could get better!

I guess he is our top goal scorer, so is he a waste? Discuss... lol

I personally believe he is a waste.. That may be difficult to prove now
because he is expected to be out for weeks. and then it will will
considered we should give him TIME to get over his injury and back
into the squad and THEN its the end of the season almost.

ippers · Post by **ippers** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:12 am

Joe always seems to have his favourites i.e. De Vos and Horlock for two and IMO him and Willie arn't particulay good coaches because how many players have actually improved under their leadership? The only one that springs to mind is Kuqi and they tried to offload him so can hardly take teh credit for his form last season. PPl say and I agree that he has had his hands tied but he still had the money last season to bring ppl in with Unsworth, Currie and especially Scowcroft being argueably dud ones. Its hard to criticise him for our league postions but he inherited Bent, Jim,Counago,Miller,Westlake etc who were bound to give us goals. The one weak position we had was Defence and his signings of Diallo, Santos, De Vos etc hardly strengthened it. His tactics this seaosn have gone out the window completely as well

SashaBlue · Post by **SashaBlue** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 3:40 pm

Ojc wrote:Wilnis and Naylor as the centre backs

Forster and Proudlock up front

Currie, Westlake, Juan, Richards/Willams in midfield, if we need a injection of pace on the flanks bring on Peters, if we need to keep hold of a 1-0 lead bring on Jim to calm things down and keep hold of the ball. Its not rocket science.

Its not difficult Joe, Parkin is/was a duff buy I have lost my patience altogether with him now, donkey.

he is also top scorer, you donkey