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Probably a spoof but if not just demonstrates how fickle the scum are. A hire and fire tinpot outfit if ever there was

Isn't that how a lot of Town fans are becoming right now with MM ??

I'm surprised you've drawn that comparison Mike.

Whilst there's a massive difference between the two clubs finances and what each manager has achieved with their respective financial backing. Town fans unrest comes on the back of 15 years in this division and seemingly going nowhere soon. Compare this to scum fans getting arses and calling for the managers head after a couple of defeats!

It beggars belief frankly. I know which fan base is the more loyal, and they don't wear shyte green n yella !

Don't Norwich get more fans through the gate than ourselves when playing at home ?, that alone should stand for something. In recent years they've usually had a very good attendance at Carrow Road for match days regardless of performance and like it or not, that's something to be applauded. We ourselves have seen plenty of empty seats this season due to people's tolerance of the manager, so maybe reconsider the loyalty issue.

Fair enough if they are indeed asking for Alex Neil's departure after all the good work and achievement he brought their way then that is largely unjustified, even if they have seen a few losses in recent weeks. Hell, if they don't want him then send him down to us, many would jump at the chance to see him in position right now over McCarthy.

hallamblue wrote:I'm surprised you've drawn that comparison Mike.

Whilst there's a massive difference between the two clubs finances and what each manager has achieved with their respective financial backing. Town fans unrest comes on the back of 15 years in this division and seemingly going nowhere soon. Compare this to scum fans getting arses and calling for the managers head after a couple of defeats!

It beggars belief frankly. I know which fan base is the more loyal, and they don't wear shyte green n yella !

To be honest mate, I am not comparing us with them at all but our fans are acting in a way that reminds me of them in calling for the managers head at the first sign of a sticky spell in Four years, for me the quality of football is a little bit of an excuse with many right now.

Our crowds are dwindling week on week, whether we like it or not when they were in league One they still got upwards op 25K through the gates and while I accept that some had signed up on Three year ST deals or something the fact rem,ains they still went, I know 100% for a fact should we drop to League One we would not get 10K a week coming to watch irrespective of what deal they were offered and no matter who the manager was. That is just my thoughts and beliefs, I don't see Town fans anywhere near the same light as you do, I do not think they are that loyal at all anymore.

As for the article regarding Alex Neil I would suggest it is in fact a hoax as only a few days ago dear old Delia and her cohorts issued some garbled nonsense about how they would love to see neil at the club for the next 10 years and while we all know that ain't gonna happen I don't think they are planning to wield the axe just yet, which I may add I am very happy about as the guy is sh*te and not on the same planet as MM, with the money and players at Neil's disposal he should be miles and miles ahead of us, instead the gap is slowly closing.

Mike, if you look back a year or 18 months on the forums .... you will see the same comments / moans about Mick. So I can't see this being a knee-jerk reaction and no comparison with NCFC/Alex Neill.

The reason the crowds are dwindling is because they don't find it an enjoyable experience. Their choice. Being a fan doesn't mean you have to part with your money or your time and accept anything the club does.

There are no doubt fickle supporters and constant unrealistic moaners .... but the level has got to a stage where you can't ignore them anymore and decent, patient , realistic fans have said they've had enough.

I would like to think Mick has realised he's got to be a bit more positive - not to necessarily please the fans - but to get some points on the board.

That's exactly my point tang.

Town fans have been incredibly loyal IMO . Far better than the narwich fans. In the last 15 years they have had promotions / relegation / promotion etc etc on a regular basis . They are now mega rich due to the PL pay outs , frankly for "failure" - its totally ludicrous the way football is run now. Town have actually been punished for being consistent! But the style of Micks football leaves a lot to be desired , and on the back of over a decade of Championship football , the crowds were naturally at some point start to drop.

I would add, that Town's attendances for at least 4 years post relegation from the PL , were 4k higher compared to narwich (when they had by then been promoted to PL).....scum fans have had for a long time the ability to pay for their tickets on a no interest monthly basis, and when they hit league one they were offered a 5 yr ST option ( which was a rolling one ) for the , then current price. So little wonder fans bought into it. Many of them now are kept on the hook by the rolling year on year ST.

Town in their wisdom took years to cotton onto monthly payment options....by which time the fans had started to leave. Club Organisation has been perhaps the only thing that scum have been better at as a club.

tangfastic wrote:Mike, if you look back a year or 18 months on the forums .... you will see the same comments / moans about Mick. So I can't see this being a knee-jerk reaction and no comparison with NCFC/Alex Neill.

The reason the crowds are dwindling is because they don't find it an enjoyable experience. Their choice. Being a fan doesn't mean you have to part with your money or your time and accept anything the club does.

There are no doubt fickle supporters and constant unrealistic moaners .... but the level has got to a stage where you can't ignore them anymore and decent, patient , realistic fans have said they've had enough.

I would like to think Mick has realised he's got to be a bit more positive - not to necessarily please the fans - but to get some points on the board.

You use the term realistic, that is DEFINITELY something I do not associate with Town fans in recent seasons, we should have been nowhere near the play offs the last Two seasons given the mega gulf that now exists between teams like ourselves and teams coming down with obscene parachute payments, but MM got us into 6th and 7th place finishes, that was still deemed as failure by many last season, and please don't tell me that it wasn't cus it was ! No for me Town fans have been totally unrealistic pretty much all the time MM has been here, he has had sod all to spend and still worked wonders, this season remains a work in progress but even when we had Nine players out injured there was still little in the way of realistic expectation where results have been concerned.

We were not near the play-off's last season.

We pretty much gave that up in January/February . We picked up a few points end of last season when it was too late amid a bunch of dead-rubber matches. That 7th place could have been 10th or 12th place.... we didn't even appear to try to win games and 7th place papers over the cracks.
The season before .... Well-deserved over-achievement in 6 th place. That 6th place was a world away from last season's 7th place.

Go back to the forum debates in Jan/Feb/March .... bet there's hardly any play-off optimism.

It doesn't matter when you pick points up, you finish where you deserve to finish and we ended up 7th, how that comes about is irrelevent, the fact we never looked like making the play offs was a realistic position we should have been in, to finish 7th was still a very good over achievement. We lost one of the last Eight games and it became mathematically impossible to make the play offs when we drew 0-0 at promoted Middlesbrough (a very good performance that day by the way) which was the 3rd last game of the season so quite how we had given up in January I have no idea, you may well have done.

bluemike wrote:

hallamblue wrote:I'm surprised you've drawn that comparison Mike.

Whilst there's a massive difference between the two clubs finances and what each manager has achieved with their respective financial backing. Town fans unrest comes on the back of 15 years in this division and seemingly going nowhere soon. Compare this to scum fans getting arses and calling for the managers head after a couple of defeats!

It beggars belief frankly. I know which fan base is the more loyal, and they don't wear shyte green n yella !

To be honest mate, I am not comparing us with them at all but our fans are acting in a way that reminds me of them in calling for the managers head at the first sign of a sticky spell in Four years, for me the quality of football is a little bit of an excuse with many right now.

Our crowds are dwindling week on week, whether we like it or not when they were in league One they still got upwards op 25K through the gates and while I accept that some had signed up on Three year ST deals or something the fact rem,ains they still went, I know 100% for a fact should we drop to League One we would not get 10K a week coming to watch irrespective of what deal they were offered and no matter who the manager was. That is just my thoughts and beliefs, I don't see Town fans anywhere near the same light as you do, I do not think they are that loyal at all anymore.

As for the article regarding Alex Neil I would suggest it is in fact a hoax as only a few days ago dear old Delia and her cohorts issued some garbled nonsense about how they would love to see neil at the club for the next 10 years and while we all know that ain't gonna happen I don't think they are planning to wield the axe just yet, which I may add I am very happy about as the guy is sh*te and not on the same planet as MM, with the money and players at Neil's disposal he should be miles and miles ahead of us, instead the gap is slowly closing.

Our football has been dire for the last twelve months its no wonder our fans are walking away from £35 seats to watch . In actual fact i feel ME should be investigated for trade discriptions act, not sure they should be calling it a "football match". I also cant see people using the quality of football as an excuse, i mean there is NO quality being shown right now. Now i suppose my comments make me unloyal to itfc, especially as i have not been to a home game this season however i have supported town for 43 years and continue to do so. Just because i will not waste my hard earned money to watch a stubborn yorkshireman play the same shyte every game does not make me unloyal. MM is fast becomming like roy keane, its his way and fu@k anyone else including people like me who have followed town all my life and will (god willing) still be here long after he leaves.

Your comments don't make you unloyal at all some of them are very valid. My point is regarding what fickle fans are, and in my opinion fans that stop going when the going is tough or because they feel they are watching sh*te entertainment are fickle, there is nothing wrong with that, it isn't a crime to be fickle and/or disloyal but it is what it is. Being unable to go due to cost or location or work whatever are totally different things but to say I'm fed up with that and won't go until it or we improve can only be fickle.

I used to follow the speedway team all over the country, hardly a track I haven't been to and never missed a home Thursday night, but it got to the point where we were basically bloody rank bad and not enjoyable to watch anymore, I also do not like the current management set up so I stopped going Three seasons back, does that make me fickle in my eyes, yes 100% but so what, its my choice, how can I possibly be as important to the club as those who turn out every week to stand on the terraces and cheer the team ? I can't, it's as simple as that.

People have every right to vote with their feet and stop going to watch Town, every right, but to claim they are still as important to the club as those that go is wrong, to suggest they will one day return when things are much better to watch and we are winning more while the hard core 14K carry the team through the difficult times is the epitome of fickleness for me but as I said it isn't a crime and I can actually understand it, what I cant understand is fickle fans not liking being called it.

You get to see a number of posters on Town related forums where their opinion on the team and manager changes as often as the weather, but I don't point it out to them as somehow it seems improper and furthermore it only invariably degenerates into argument.

Seriously, take the last game for instance, on the basis of one game alone, the number of those who were calling for the managers head directly before, then having a sudden turnaround was astounding. Not necessarily here, but no real need to elaborate where (exactly) this instance took place.

I didn't comment on the post-game reaction that day. Wasn't going to f*ck around, my opinion remained as it was before and wasn't prepared to blow sunshine up Mick McCarthy's as* after one result and tell a lie. Thing is there a number of people out there who seem apprehensive - almost afraid - of putting across their views sometimes as it can only lead to disagreement and ultimately some level of abuse.

Seems you're damned if you do and damned if you don't but going to be interesting to see what occurs in the next game up and how people react. Not going to play any damn fickle card, win lose or draw it won't change opinion in wanting relevant names out of the club.

saint jude wrote:there a number of people out there who seem apprehensive - almost afraid - of putting across their views sometimes as it can only lead to disagreement and ultimately some level of abuse.

Nope.

I think the majority of people just don't feel the need to write novels of f**king mindnumbing wind & pish.

marko69 wrote:Nope.

I think the majority of people just don't feel the need to write novels of f**king mindnumbing wind & pish.

bluemike wrote:I used to follow the speedway team all over the country, hardly a track I haven't been to and never missed a home Thursday night, but it got to the point where we were basically bloody rank bad and not enjoyable to watch anymore, I also do not like the current management set up so I stopped going Three seasons back, does that make me fickle in my eyes, yes 100% but so what, its my choice, how can I possibly be as important to the club as those who turn out every week to stand on the terraces and cheer the team ? I can't, it's as simple as that.

I used to go to the occasional speedway meet, being 4 hours from Ipswich I lost a fair bit of interest when they seemingly chose to be relegated (what the hell was that all about by the way?!). Kept one eye on it in case they found a bit of inspiration, but the results have looked pretty woeful. I thought Chris Louis would become manager and do a good job after he retired, but decided against that route... from the little I know.

I digress, back to the topic, I don't think town fans are fickle and I think that that is almost to a fault, many fans have quietly given up going over the last few years, no signs of displeasure, no debates, no 'what are we going to do' etc. I usually hate moany fans, but at Ipswich I feel the fans are reasonable and should be listened to when they do moan.

Fans disappear because they know what is going to happen, who goes to the cinema and watches the same film week in week out. Fans are retained and new ones gained through excitement. A fair few years back I even said it could be better for the club to drop another division and was (probably rightly) shot down for it. But a promotion battle/success in league 1 entices new fans and excites old ones, the ones that stopped going when the team dropped down, would return when the team gets promoted. You should see how excited my friends get when their lower league teams full of three-legged inbreds and plumbers get promoted, a fair bit more excited than I get with another mid table finish in the championship that's for sure. It's passion and excitement people want, not to grind out a 0-0 because it means we won't get relegated. F*** it, go all out, lose 6-3 and get relegated, at least we tried and gave ourselves a chance of succeeding.

The thing is, fans in my eyes are absolutely the most crucial part of a football club. Players, managers, owners, money comes and goes, but if the fan base shrinks, it can be a disaster, that's what scares me about the current regime, not that we're not going to get promoted this year, but that we continue to lose fans and that is what needs to be addressed. If the generation of youngsters at the age of picking their team for life end up picking others because we need to live 'within our means', then a few years down the line 'our means' is going to be smaller and smaller and smaller.

Ricco wrote:

marko69 wrote:Nope.

I think the majority of people just don't feel the need to write novels of f**king mindnumbing wind & pish.

bluemike wrote:I used to follow the speedway team all over the country, hardly a track I haven't been to and never missed a home Thursday night, but it got to the point where we were basically bloody rank bad and not enjoyable to watch anymore, I also do not like the current management set up so I stopped going Three seasons back, does that make me fickle in my eyes, yes 100% but so what, its my choice, how can I possibly be as important to the club as those who turn out every week to stand on the terraces and cheer the team ? I can't, it's as simple as that.

I used to go to the occasional speedway meet, being 4 hours from Ipswich I lost a fair bit of interest when they seemingly chose to be relegated (what the hell was that all about by the way?!). Kept one eye on it in case they found a bit of inspiration, but the results have looked pretty woeful. I thought Chris Louis would become manager and do a good job after he retired, but decided against that route... from the little I know.

I digress, back to the topic, I don't think town fans are fickle and I think that that is almost to a fault, many fans have quietly given up going over the last few years, no signs of displeasure, no debates, no 'what are we going to do' etc. I usually hate moany fans, but at Ipswich I feel the fans are reasonable and should be listened to when they do moan.

Fans disappear because they know what is going to happen, who goes to the cinema and watches the same film week in week out. Fans are retained and new ones gained through excitement. A fair few years back I even said it could be better for the club to drop another division and was (probably rightly) shot down for it. But a promotion battle/success in league 1 entices new fans and excites old ones, the ones that stopped going when the team dropped down, would return when the team gets promoted. You should see how excited my friends get when their lower league teams full of three-legged inbreds and plumbers get promoted, a fair bit more excited than I get with another mid table finish in the championship that's for sure. It's passion and excitement people want, not to grind out a 0-0 because it means we won't get relegated. F*** it, go all out, lose 6-3 and get relegated, at least we tried and gave ourselves a chance of succeeding.

The thing is, fans in my eyes are absolutely the most crucial part of a football club. Players, managers, owners, money comes and goes, but if the fan base shrinks, it can be a disaster, that's what scares me about the current regime, not that we're not going to get promoted this year, but that we continue to lose fans and that is what needs to be addressed. If the generation of youngsters at the age of picking their team for life end up picking others because we need to live 'within our means', then a few years down the line 'our means' is going to be smaller and smaller and smaller.

Ricco !!! Bloody hell, welcome back to the madness !!! I laughed out loud at the highlighted bit by the way, A good post, keep em coming.

bluemike wrote:Ricco !!! Bloody hell, welcome back to the madness !!! I laughed out loud at the highlighted bit by the way, A good post, keep em coming.

Have to make up for the time away huh?!!

Yes you will, where the hell you been ?

As one of the fans who has 'voted with his feet', I'll share how I feel.
Having supported Town since I was 3 (so quite a few years) - the vast majority of this time as an ST holder, it was a really hard decision for me to stop watching them.
I do not think I am fickle at all - it's simply utter despair at 15 years in the same league, lack of ambition and investment during the only real chance we've had in all that time to get out (well that and a certain Scotsman being too free with his hands), and the total dross being played.
Fickle? No, I call it being true to myself.

The thing is Gary, you have been consistent in your thoughts even when we were doing well and making the play offs so no thst is hardly fickle.

rossi wrote:well that and a certain Scotsman being too free with his hands.

And he's a Jambo, double whammy!

Still maintain that the entire ITFC team could've momentarily all deliberately played basketball, they still weren't beating Norwich in the PO's.

bluemike wrote:Isn't that how a lot of Town fans are becoming right now with MM ??

And now justify this comment

ipswichtownNo1 wrote:

bluemike wrote:Isn't that how a lot of Town fans are becoming right now with MM ??

And now justify this comment

There is nothing to justify, the fans have been fickle way before today mate, have you been waiting all week for that to happen to post that ? LOL.

Never realised the word ' fickle' could cause so much offence.

Maybe it shouldn't be seen as an insult. Maybe a bit of fickleness means you can see things a bit clearer and not get caught up in over-blown blind loyalty.

I wish Mick had a bit more fickleness, because he's loyal beyond belief to Chambers, Skuse, Berra... and others. They do not repay his loyalty based on performances like last night. Senior pros who's bar has been set far to low by Mick instead of leading by example. They will be in Micks ear telling him to bring back Dougie in midfield.... because the lack of another defensive CM exposes them as very mediocre players.

Not time for a " KICK FICKLENESS OUT" campaign... maybe a dollop of fickle once in a while is needed.

Tang you are spot on, I also have no idea why the word fickle causes so much offence, as I have already said, I get it and understand it, what I don't get is why some are in denial. After yesterday's sh*te I wish I was fickle I can tell you.

bluemike wrote:Isn't that how a lot of Town fans are becoming right now with MM ??

Maybe so, but that is after 3 years of mediocre uninspiring football, not 3 games.

bluemike wrote:Tang you are spot on, I also have no idea why the word fickle causes so much offence.

You can't see why?

the definition of fickle includes descriptors such

To change your mind without good reason

to lack consistency

To lack reliability

To be erratic


Town fans by and large are far from this IMO.

WE have had to put up with 15 YEAR'S of mediocrity
3 YEAR'S of utter dross in terms of style of football
No evidence of meaningful progression - quote the reverse

15 YEARS of tip off Ticket prices
The sale of our best talent to the tune of £23m with no n meaningful re investment into the squad.

Paying top wack to watch ageing journeymen, loanees by the Cartload



Scum by comparison throw a f**king wobbly after losing just FOUR games. They have been Promoted 3 if not 4 times in the last 15 yrs. So have had plenty to cheer about. Yt they whinge / moan and bleat about hard done by they are. They don't know they are born frankly.

Scum are Fickle in every sense of the word.

Town fans are remarkably loyal given the decade+ . of underachievement, underinvestment and extortionate prices levied at their fan base. We have every right to complain now IMO and the Club don't know how lucky they are to have such a tolerant fan base. However Town fans unlike scum aren't gabby....they just choose to " vote with their feet".

So I can see why Die hard Town fans get upset at being called fickle.

As I have said elsewhere, I really don't get why fans are upset at being labelled fickle, to me there is nothing wrong with being fickle if that is how people choose to be. Somebody who says " I am not going to watch Town anymore until we are playing better and winning more" is in my eyes 100% fickle, so what, good luck to them, maybe they are the sensible ones but fickle it is, and most of those examples of what fickle means is spot on, unreliable, erratic, lack consistency etc etc. I disagree that Town fans are not this, for me they very much are these days, maybe they have good reason, that is all about opinion, but I am of the opinion that support of your club is non conditional, good with the bad and all that.

I don't agree that the last Three years have been utter dross, 6th and 7th place finishes with what we have at our disposal was nothing short of remarkable and MM played to the strengths of the squad he had and it worked, pretty at times it may not be but I don't see it as utter dross, what was it Nine away wins in our play off season, last season we had I believe the second best home record, obviously this season is where the problems lie but that should not detract from the achievements of the previous seasons. If the last Three seasons have been utter dross who in their right mind goes back for more this season ? Surely that was a choice many could have made but it can't have been that bad or they wouldn't have returned.

15 years of rip off ticket prices is an area where the club falls down but lets not forget ME has frozen ticket prices every year excpet One I believe so it was the good old family run club days that caused this issue not the current owner, for all his faults that is not his doing.

I must admit I am not sure why we are comparing ourselves with that load of sh*te up the road, I have very little interest in what goes on up there apart from hoping they get stuffed every weekend.

Hallam, the recent EU referendum at the High School....... I voted with my feet. Should've seen the looks I was getting. And I'll tell you what, it's no easy!

Regarding "fickle"...... Maybe we should all just be like Phil Grandison, the old British Gas technician. The guy owned a scarf for almost all the teams in Scotland. Whoever was top of the SPL, he'd wear that scarf on the Monday morning!

I remember him turning up at heating installation in late August one year in the 90's wearing a St Mirren scarf......
"What aboot those Buddies eh? CLASS team!"