Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

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Charnwood
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Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Charnwood » Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:14 am

A simple question guys, why is Tomas Holy out of favour with Paul Lambert ?

In his time at Gillingham he made 107 appearances and kept 25 clean sheets in all competitions.

Since joining Town on 24th of May, 2019, on a free transfer he’s made an immediate impact. He kept six clean sheets in his first ten league games, including a run of five consecutive clean sheets, which I understand is a club record.

I don’t understand why Lambert would risk destroying his confidence by dropping him to the bench, it doesn’t make sense.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:48 am

I couldn't agree with you more Andy, Holy has been a breath of fresh air since we signed him, not only in his performances either but his demeanour and enthusiasm for the club and the fans too, for me he has pretty much done nothing wrong, he called himself out for one of the goals at Accrington which maybe he had a part in and some suggested he should have done better for the first Rotherham goal but standing directly behind that I can honestly say he was unsighted until late as it came through players blocking his view but in any case if we are looking for one or Two errors in Fifteen games then bloody hell we are knit picking for sure. His all round game is fine and leaves Bart standing in most areas.

Paul Lambert can pretty much do no wrong in my eyes but this is one decision that I disagree with him on 100%, Holy should never have lost his place and I really couldn't care less about Norris needing a game to keep him up to speed, what nonsense, how often do you lose a keeper to injury or suspension ? Very rarely, it doesn't sit well with me that we are potentially pissing off one of our own to keep a loanee happy, maybe Wolves have had a say as has been suggested but tough and while Norris has also done little wrong when called upon he came him knowing full well Holy was starting as the recognised Number One as he said so in his interview himself. Ten goals we've conceded all season so for me Holy can count himself very unlucky. With Two cup games now coming up I suspect we will see the big man back between the sticks so quite who gets the gloves in our next league game at home to Blackpool is anyone's guess but I know where my vote goes.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour

Post by tangfastic » Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:54 am

It is a bit of a mystery.

By all accounts, Holy comes across as a really good guy so I’m not sure he’s a problem player.

Could be Wolves putting us under pressure. Maybe Lambert is lining up some Portuguese loan talent in January and is keeping Wolves sweet.

I think his general goalkeeping has been pretty good. I must say his distribution hasn’t been so good - overcooked too many kicks and when you don’t have Norwood there to battle with the centre-half’s we generally give the ball away. Not sure that Norris is that much better, if at all, at distribution, though.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:16 am

Did you see Norris's kicking at Southend ?? Laughable, hooked every one to the opposite side of the pitch to where every Town player was positioned, windy it may have been but my god adjust your feet man.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by hallamblue » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:51 am

I don’t think he is “out of favour” especially. I just think Lambo is ensuring we have two keepers up to speed for game time. If a GK is constantly kept on the bench , ( as Gerken was under McCarthy), then they are nowhere near as game sharp when they are eventually called upon. It also ensures that EVERY player “ feels” a valued part of the squad rotation the manager is using. Gerken certainly didn’t ever feel he would be given game time , hence why he left. Finally , it serves to keep both GK’s on their metal and ensures true competition for their place. Under McCarthy, Bart never had to fear for his place, which may have had a lot to do with his form, frankly. I honestly think he felt he was untouchable.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Shed on tour » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:38 pm

As I said on another thread I’m very much of the opinion that a manager should decide on his number 1 and stick by him unless he suffers a dramatic loss of form or injury.
In the case of Holy none of the above has happened. Also a keeper and his defenders need to build up confidence and understanding between themselves and if you are going to chop and change the keepers on a regular basis then this becomes harder to develop.
The other final thing which I also mentioned in my previous comment is that come next season Holy will no doubt still be on our books where Norris won’t. Therefore, imo Holy should still be the number 1 at the moment.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:11 pm

Spot on for me Shed, the big point there is the understanding that is developed between Keeper & Defence.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by hallamblue » Thu Nov 07, 2019 6:56 pm

I think Norris has only played 4 times for 1st teams since he’s been here. So not exactly chopping and changing. But I take your point Shed .

The only thing PL might have done, was to mix it up a bit because the two games prior to Norris’ introduction, Town had lost 2 back to back games 2-0 - PL states publicly that he doesn’t lay any blame at Holy’s door for those goals
( Mike you went to the games, what’s your view?) . I suspect Holy will be back between the sticks for the next league match .

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:08 pm

As I said he held his hands up for one of the goals at Accrington but we are picking up on one mistake in 15 games !!! I could mention 6 or 7 one on ones that Norwood has missed and should have scored , or the numerous crosses Judge has overhit, or the Chambo error agsinst Sunderland so you get my point, Holy has, in my opinion, been treated poorly

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Blue Wilf » Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:25 pm

We have to assume that something has been seen in training or something has happened that we will find out in due course. I agree, I would have stuck with Holy. Will be interesting to see who plays on Saturday.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by hallamblue » Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:53 pm

Well as it’s round one of the cup, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Norris keep the shirt, but as I’ve said I would expect Holy back for the next league game. I don’t see anything sinister here, just PL doing what PL seems to want to do, chop n change the team.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Fri Nov 08, 2019 12:06 am

No I agree, nothing sinister or untoward just an error by Lambert on this occasion for me.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by derick_ipsw » Fri Nov 08, 2019 7:16 am

You didn't have to be at the game as it was broadcast on TV so thousands of people could see Holy was definitely at fault for Accringtons first goal. a looping cross that ends up on the 6 yard line, at 6ft 7in he should of been coming for that. I also watched the Rotherham game on ifollow and thought he was at fault for going with his feet not his hands for their first goal. Saying that, i don't think he should of been dropped. Unless in training his confidence is shot and he is dropping balls all over the place.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Fri Nov 08, 2019 8:30 am

Lambert begs to differ.....
It was nothing against Tomas whatsoever, he's been absolutely outstanding for us and he wasn't at fault for any of the goals in the last two games. I just felt Will needed a game and a little bit of a lift. He trains really hard and pushes Tomas to the limit. I just felt this one was the right call.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by marko69 » Fri Nov 08, 2019 8:48 am

Can’t speak for the Rotherham game as didn’t see it or didn’t see highlights....... but did make a comment about him potentially having “flap” tendencies in his game after witnessing the Accrington game. He obviously wasn’t directly at fault for the goal, but I’m fairly certain, if Lambo was questioned on that alone, he’d admit maybe it should’ve been dealt with better by the very tall keeper.

Can speak for everyone and just how critical people are at times, but for me, Tomas Holy should be plucking everything out of the air that comes into the box. So it becomes a question of his positioning and reading / judgement of the game. Everything I’ve saw so far from highlights appears to be ok from Holy; he does command the box and it’s highly unfortunate that the Accrington goal was on SKYTV. Could give people less forgiving ammo to vent their thing!

...... and ...... that’s why I personally don’t use the TWTD machine. Endless posts of big opinions less than 10 minutes after the final whistle.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:02 am

Holy himself said he was at fault for that goal, but my point is, one mistake in 15 games!!! Bloody joke, and I dont agree he had any fault in the Rotherham goal at all, a Town player in the build up cocked up to start with and the shot came through players with Holy unsighted.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by derick_ipsw » Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:47 pm

marko69 wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 8:48 am
Can’t speak for the Rotherham game as didn’t see it or didn’t see highlights....... but did make a comment about him potentially having “flap” tendencies in his game after witnessing the Accrington game. He obviously wasn’t directly at fault for the goal, but I’m fairly certain, if Lambo was questioned on that alone, he’d admit maybe it should’ve been dealt with better by the very tall keeper.

Can speak for everyone and just how critical people are at times, but for me, Tomas Holy should be plucking everything out of the air that comes into the box. So it becomes a question of his positioning and reading / judgement of the game. Everything I’ve saw so far from highlights appears to be ok from Holy; he does command the box and it’s highly unfortunate that the Accrington goal was on SKYTV. Could give people less forgiving ammo to vent their thing!

...... and ...... that’s why I personally don’t use the TWTD machine. Endless posts of big opinions less than 10 minutes after the final whistle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?edufilter ... rqpSwdsAZA . Watch this. Why did he go with his feet? View seems pretty good as well.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Bluemike » Fri Nov 08, 2019 4:10 pm

I still think Skuse was bundled off the ball all too easily and then Chambo miss controls it before sprawling right in the keepers eye line as the shot was made, at that speed I don't see how Holy could get down to that with anything other than his feet ? If that is what Holy is dropped for it's a joke and Skuse & Chambo should be dropped too, and yes Derick I know what is coming next !!! :lol: :lol:

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by marko69 » Fri Nov 08, 2019 5:01 pm

One of them..... 🤷‍♂️ Could’ve done better, but hmmmm??? Not enough to really slate the guy.

In that entire clip, I’m seeing Huws as being at fault for the second. Classic ball watching. If he’d been more aware and flicked that ball to his left, I think Downes is there to collect..... but bounces off his calf to Skuse..... but Skuse didn’t appear to have many options apart from maybe putting the laces through it sideways. Either way he was going to come in for some stick. Nice finish second goal. Think most goalies lose that gamble.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by hallamblue » Fri Nov 08, 2019 5:37 pm

Well since no fault can be found with Holy, this kind a supports PL comment that he doesn’t blame Holy for anything, and therefore he has been rested for no other reason than PL wanting to give Norris some game time. We haven’t suffered for it either have we. 😁👍

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by derick_ipsw » Fri Nov 08, 2019 8:01 pm

Bluemike wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 4:10 pm
I still think Skuse was bundled off the ball all too easily and then Chambo miss controls it before sprawling right in the keepers eye line as the shot was made, at that speed I don't see how Holy could get down to that with anything other than his feet ? If that is what Holy is dropped for it's a joke and Skuse & Chambo should be dropped too, and yes Derick I know what is coming next !!! :lol: :lol:
I have already said he should not of been dropped but we don't see what goes on in training. If he is spilling stuff then maybe he did need pulling out. Regarding Skuse and Chambers isn't amazing that everybody is getting rotated except those 2.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by hallamblue » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:53 pm

Every team has players that will always play . Tbh Derek I dread to think what done if these “ close” games would have been like without the Chambers / Skuse experience in the side. They do more for the tram / Club than they are given credit for.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by marko69 » Fri Nov 08, 2019 11:50 pm

hallamblue wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:53 pm
They do more for the tram / Club than they are given credit for.

Who drives? I bet Skuse drives. Chambo checks tickets. Anyone chancing two stops without paying ------> big fk off chambo sliding tackle at the tram door.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by hallamblue » Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:24 am

😂 oh bloody shittin predicted text at it again!!! And trust you to spot it marko lol

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by marko69 » Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:17 am

hallamblue wrote:
Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:24 am
😂 oh bloody shittin predicted text at it again!!! And trust you to spot it marko lol
Was actually half expecting a few Chambo lovers to post;
“He’d miss. Free tram rides all round!” :lol:

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by tangfastic » Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:35 am

Skuse was most at fault for both those goals. Obvious mistake for the second and just not strong enough to shield the ball for the first. I can understand why questions get asked why Chambers and Skuse don’t get rotated - but I always come back to Mick, Hurst and PL all keeping faith with them. Can they all be wrong? Having said that - we’ve won with Chambo out of the side so I’m not sure about how much they’re vital to the team.

I’m OK with Skuse and Chambers in the team. Mind you,I wouldn’t be surprised to see Nolan and Downes in a central midfield partnership in a 4-4-2 in the near future, with Skuse making way. It gives us more going forward. PL did make a comment about Skuse recently that age always catches up with you - so maybe paving the way for a ‘rest’ period.

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Re: Why is Tomas Holy out of favour ?

Post by Charnwood » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:52 pm

Maybe Tomas will get a game with the second team at Colchester tomorrow night.

Let’s hope his confidence hasn’t been shot by being dropped.

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