Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

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Charnwood
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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by Charnwood » Mon May 03, 2021 9:57 pm

ashfordblue wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 4:57 pm
Charnwood wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 4:22 pm
To be honest Marko after the two Sirs there really isn’t a lot to improve on, maybe Bill McGarry maybe George Burley at his best but I still blame him for being the one who kicked off our decline with his horrendous waste of money transfers. GB really was a five minute “wonder boy” of a manager who was quickly found out and fell out of favour almost as fast as he climbed the managerial ladder. If Paul Cook could win League One that would put him up there with only a handful of trophy winners and win promotion from the Championship too as I think he could, that would definitely put him 3rd to the two Knights. It’s as simple as that Marko.
Don't Forget Joe Royale Charners :D :D he done a fab job on no money 👌😍
I’ll never forget Joe Royle Ash, he really was one of our best managers and at a very difficult time too taking us through Administration and as you say getting good results on a shoestring budget. He would definitely have got a mention had I not been focusing exclusively on successful managers, but with that in mind not surprisingly he didn’t win a trophy.

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by hallamblue » Mon May 03, 2021 10:33 pm

Tang: thank you for your reply .

I think a few things unravelled and most are not linked .

Robson left for the England job. Players also moved in . That natural cycle had begun to come full circle and Town couldn’t maintain that momentum.


But then The stars begin to align , badly for us .

1) Town qualified for UEFA by virtue of the Fair Play League
2) The collapse of digital tv money
3) Town get relegated at the end of arguably the most difficult, 2nd season

The worst thing for us was to qualify for the UEFA cup . We didn’t have the squad to deal with the travelling and preparation for the next PL ( this was a comment by a Town defender when commenting on what went wrong ). So we battled relegation the whole if that 2nd season.

We get relegated. The squad is Cherry picked ? Mostly by Charlton if I recall rightly ). We were in trouble financially having players on expensive contracts , and we couldn’t offload . Not sure if the timing , but digital tv collapse happened pretty close to this period .... a hammer blow to us. We lost ( I think ) the equivalent of two decent squads of players over 2-3 seasons .

We were in dire straits and entered the CVA. Players such as Stewart bring offloaded at the 12th hour for peanuts to avoid the Club folding (These were Bowden’s words to me).

So yes clubs such as Brighton Burnley etc have done well over similar period , but they hadn’t been hit like we had ( expensive contracts and relegation ) . I don’t think these parachute payments were being paid then , otherwise things may have been different , I don’t know .

You say we can’t keep blaming Sky money. But I would disagree with you I’m afraid . Sky money had changed the very nature of the game , and unless your club is involved in this false yo-yo corridor between Championship <> PL , you never get the benefits of Sky money.

Until Hurst dismantled the squad snd replaced it with League One : Two players , Town had comfortably been an “ established “ Championship Club, but hadnt a hope in hell of competing with the top 10 clubs in that division who were “failed “ PL clubs but enjoying £100m Sky money backing . Little wonder Evans gave up trying to compete really .

But as you say , looking forwards, now with potentially heavy USA backers , Town hopefully can finally now rebuild ( over next 2 seasons I’d guess) and make it back to the Championship. If our backers are true to their word, we should be able to compete with yo- yo PL who are funded by Sky money. Without these backers Town would without doubt become an established League One / Two club.

Sadly it’s all about money : nothing else . A sad end to the game as most of us have known it tbh .

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by Charnwood » Mon May 03, 2021 10:55 pm

It doesn’t have to be the end Liz, we just have to get on the bus.

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by hallamblue » Tue May 04, 2021 7:28 am

Well that’s true , “if you can’t beat em join em”. My point is the game is no longer a level playing field .

Just imagine our future if we were still with Evans .... or no financial backer , which is the majority of clubs in this country . Our future (and theirs ) is very bleak. And what happens to Town when our USA backers sell up ( as they will at some point). We no longer have control of our future do we.

But like you , I’ll enjoy the adventure we are hopefully about to embark on. But football I think is in a sorry old state now , and it’s money that’s killed it for most fans.

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by Bluemike » Tue May 04, 2021 10:09 am

hallamblue wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 10:33 pm
Tang: thank you for your reply .

I think a few things unravelled and most are not linked .

Robson left for the England job. Players also moved in . That natural cycle had begun to come full circle and Town couldn’t maintain that momentum.


But then The stars begin to align , badly for us .

1) Town qualified for UEFA by virtue of the Fair Play League
2) The collapse of digital tv money
3) Town get relegated at the end of arguably the most difficult, 2nd season

The worst thing for us was to qualify for the UEFA cup . We didn’t have the squad to deal with the travelling and preparation for the next PL ( this was a comment by a Town defender when commenting on what went wrong ). So we battled relegation the whole if that 2nd season.

We get relegated. The squad is Cherry picked ? Mostly by Charlton if I recall rightly ). We were in trouble financially having players on expensive contracts , and we couldn’t offload . Not sure if the timing , but digital tv collapse happened pretty close to this period .... a hammer blow to us. We lost ( I think ) the equivalent of two decent squads of players over 2-3 seasons .

We were in dire straits and entered the CVA. Players such as Stewart bring offloaded at the 12th hour for peanuts to avoid the Club folding (These were Bowden’s words to me).

So yes clubs such as Brighton Burnley etc have done well over similar period , but they hadn’t been hit like we had ( expensive contracts and relegation ) . I don’t think these parachute payments were being paid then , otherwise things may have been different , I don’t know .

You say we can’t keep blaming Sky money. But I would disagree with you I’m afraid . Sky money had changed the very nature of the game , and unless your club is involved in this false yo-yo corridor between Championship <> PL , you never get the benefits of Sky money.

Until Hurst dismantled the squad snd replaced it with League One : Two players , Town had comfortably been an “ established “ Championship Club, but hadnt a hope in hell of competing with the top 10 clubs in that division who were “failed “ PL clubs but enjoying £100m Sky money backing . Little wonder Evans gave up trying to compete really .

But as you say , looking forwards, now with potentially heavy USA backers , Town hopefully can finally now rebuild ( over next 2 seasons I’d guess) and make it back to the Championship. If our backers are true to their word, we should be able to compete with yo- yo PL who are funded by Sky money. Without these backers Town would without doubt become an established League One / Two club.

Sadly it’s all about money : nothing else . A sad end to the game as most of us have known it tbh .
An excellent summing up of much of what has befallen us in recent times.

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by Steve and Jo » Tue May 04, 2021 10:50 am

Bluemike wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 10:09 am
hallamblue wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 10:33 pm
Tang: thank you for your reply .

I think a few things unravelled and most are not linked .

Robson left for the England job. Players also moved in . That natural cycle had begun to come full circle and Town couldn’t maintain that momentum.


But then The stars begin to align , badly for us .

1) Town qualified for UEFA by virtue of the Fair Play League
2) The collapse of digital tv money
3) Town get relegated at the end of arguably the most difficult, 2nd season

The worst thing for us was to qualify for the UEFA cup . We didn’t have the squad to deal with the travelling and preparation for the next PL ( this was a comment by a Town defender when commenting on what went wrong ). So we battled relegation the whole if that 2nd season.

We get relegated. The squad is Cherry picked ? Mostly by Charlton if I recall rightly ). We were in trouble financially having players on expensive contracts , and we couldn’t offload . Not sure if the timing , but digital tv collapse happened pretty close to this period .... a hammer blow to us. We lost ( I think ) the equivalent of two decent squads of players over 2-3 seasons .

We were in dire straits and entered the CVA. Players such as Stewart bring offloaded at the 12th hour for peanuts to avoid the Club folding (These were Bowden’s words to me).

So yes clubs such as Brighton Burnley etc have done well over similar period , but they hadn’t been hit like we had ( expensive contracts and relegation ) . I don’t think these parachute payments were being paid then , otherwise things may have been different , I don’t know .

You say we can’t keep blaming Sky money. But I would disagree with you I’m afraid . Sky money had changed the very nature of the game , and unless your club is involved in this false yo-yo corridor between Championship <> PL , you never get the benefits of Sky money.

Until Hurst dismantled the squad snd replaced it with League One : Two players , Town had comfortably been an “ established “ Championship Club, but hadnt a hope in hell of competing with the top 10 clubs in that division who were “failed “ PL clubs but enjoying £100m Sky money backing . Little wonder Evans gave up trying to compete really .

But as you say , looking forwards, now with potentially heavy USA backers , Town hopefully can finally now rebuild ( over next 2 seasons I’d guess) and make it back to the Championship. If our backers are true to their word, we should be able to compete with yo- yo PL who are funded by Sky money. Without these backers Town would without doubt become an established League One / Two club.

Sadly it’s all about money : nothing else . A sad end to the game as most of us have known it tbh .
An excellent summing up of much of what has befallen us in recent times.
As Mike says an excellent summery for it really is spot on what Liz wrote

I remember listening to Mattie Holland when he was asked his opinions on why we went from fifth to regulation in two seasons.

He did say the leaving of Richard Wright was major, the players who left being replaced by high profile players coming in on high wages possibly unsettled season established players at the club. The goalkeeper issue was massive though for Matteo Sereni's English was not the best, especially at the beginning. Europe played huge part yet as he says some of our better performances were in Europe. He mentioned the backing of the North stand was hugely missed as the now Sir Bobby Robson stand was being built. He mentioned the noise was drifting away, not having the home core backing especially when things were going badly was massive disadvantage. Another factor was turning of the year. Ipswich went on a strong run winning games that actually taken us out of the bottom three. I remember beating Sunderland 5-0 or 5-1 I think it was but then disaster again. We had a three week break, not sure why. Other clubs kept playing but we had a three week break then lost to Southampton which taken us back into the regulation places which we never recovered.

Summing up there were few reasons and yes Burley bringing in higher wage earners really did unsettle but the fall out from Digital TV was immense. The loss in revenue battered us with also considering the loans taken out for ground improvements for later seasons.

Far as early 80's when Sir Bobby left. We again just expanded the stadium also. The Pioneer stand was increased in capacity with cost over two million pounds. That was massive amount in those days which didn't help and some players including Brazil I seem to remember saying that Bobby Ferguson though great coach was not so good manager. Strange how could say expanding the stadium twice had impact twice in our down turn

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by tangfastic » Tue May 04, 2021 11:36 am

hallamblue wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 10:33 pm
Tang: thank you for your reply .

I think a few things unravelled and most are not linked .

Robson left for the England job. Players also moved in . That natural cycle had begun to come full circle and Town couldn’t maintain that momentum.


But then The stars begin to align , badly for us .

1) Town qualified for UEFA by virtue of the Fair Play League
2) The collapse of digital tv money
3) Town get relegated at the end of arguably the most difficult, 2nd season

The worst thing for us was to qualify for the UEFA cup . We didn’t have the squad to deal with the travelling and preparation for the next PL ( this was a comment by a Town defender when commenting on what went wrong ). So we battled relegation the whole if that 2nd season.

We get relegated. The squad is Cherry picked ? Mostly by Charlton if I recall rightly ). We were in trouble financially having players on expensive contracts , and we couldn’t offload . Not sure if the timing , but digital tv collapse happened pretty close to this period .... a hammer blow to us. We lost ( I think ) the equivalent of two decent squads of players over 2-3 seasons .

We were in dire straits and entered the CVA. Players such as Stewart bring offloaded at the 12th hour for peanuts to avoid the Club folding (These were Bowden’s words to me).

So yes clubs such as Brighton Burnley etc have done well over similar period , but they hadn’t been hit like we had ( expensive contracts and relegation ) . I don’t think these parachute payments were being paid then , otherwise things may have been different , I don’t know .

You say we can’t keep blaming Sky money. But I would disagree with you I’m afraid . Sky money had changed the very nature of the game , and unless your club is involved in this false yo-yo corridor between Championship <> PL , you never get the benefits of Sky money.

Until Hurst dismantled the squad snd replaced it with League One : Two players , Town had comfortably been an “ established “ Championship Club, but hadnt a hope in hell of competing with the top 10 clubs in that division who were “failed “ PL clubs but enjoying £100m Sky money backing . Little wonder Evans gave up trying to compete really .

But as you say , looking forwards, now with potentially heavy USA backers , Town hopefully can finally now rebuild ( over next 2 seasons I’d guess) and make it back to the Championship. If our backers are true to their word, we should be able to compete with yo- yo PL who are funded by Sky money. Without these backers Town would without doubt become an established League One / Two club.

Sadly it’s all about money : nothing else . A sad end to the game as most of us have known it tbh .
Strange how this thread has developed from Cooks post match interview - but still interesting.

With the relegation from the PL. Agreed, we made bad decisions and got caught out by the digital tv deal.... hence that put us back a few years. But we still recovered and stayed competitive in the Championship and then we got Evans. So even after the setbacks from the relegation - we still had a good opportunity to get back to the PL. If Evans had made better decisions and with his initial investments we should have really challenged more for a place in the Premiership. Point is... I don’t see the reason for out decline as decisions made by Burley or sheepshanks at that time, because by 2008 we had recovered and had a golden opportunity to push on. We just didn’t take that opportunity under Evans. If we’d have stayed in the PL with better decision-making, it’s almost certain we would have got relegated at some stage after a few years. There’s only 7-8 clubs who stay in the PL - the rest get relegated every so often. That’s how it works - and we haven’t rolled with the punches and just stagnated as a club in the meantime.

As for Sky... obviously it’s got way out of control and the money thrown around is ridiculous. And it has really ruined so many aspects of the game. However, apart from the big six - we’re not excluded from joining in. We’ve had opportunities to get there, but we’ve never taken them. And you don’t have to chuck ridiculous amounts of money around to get there. Just be a better run club.
And as for the nostalgic pre-Sky days - I thought the eighties were a poor decade for football (apart from the first couple of years). We had crap like Heysel and Hillsborough and the football wasn’t that good. I remember teams like Wimbledon playing terrible long-ball football. Football needed a shot in the arm in this country, and I believe Sky and the PL were initially good to give it a lift and improve it. It just got out of control. We should have had a regulatory body who should have controlled excesses.... wage caps, transfer fee caps, squad size limits, FFP, fair distribution of money, etc.

Everyone knows that the PL has become a monster and SKY is its partner in crime... but if you were to ignore the top six of the PL there’s still a lot of clubs who can join the party by getting there. We’ve never been excluded - we’ve just been a badly run club for a long time and never taken our opportunities. And as Charners has said - let’s try and jump back on the bus.

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Re: Paul Cook’s post match interview today ....

Post by Charnwood » Tue May 04, 2021 10:32 pm

... and if Paul Cook can get us promoted and back to the Championship, this would certainly be the first hurdle over and the first step to getting back on the bus.

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