Premier League - Manchester United vs Ipswich Town Preview & Matchday Thread

[Charnwood]

So bitterly disappointed with that second half no show performance and what a missed opportunity that was.

Absolutely “no show” second half and hated reading this in Sky’s second half commentary…

“Ipswich look like a Championship team. And that might be disrespectful to the Championship.”

“Ipswich were clueless about how to break them down”.

That is disappointing.

Wish I’d not woken up, now back to my sleep.

[Cabanas Blue]

The best time to play Utd. Low on confidence, at each other's throats, down to 10 men, and STILL we barely kay a glove on them. Zero attacking threat... minimal balls into the box. Zero hold up play .... the experience left onnthe bench until 80 + mins by our manager.
One trick pony finishes the game with the front line he should have started with. f**king clueless

You are not wrong I'm very disappointed

[ITFC2024]

Two lucky goals, ManU down to 10 men and we can’t even get a fuckin draw! Useless Harry McGuire scores the winner! Can’t wait ‘til we go down. I’m tired of this sh*t.

[Bluemike]

Absolutely rubbish against a sh*te team with 10 men, that was criminal losing that 3rd goal so early after the break. We cannot f**king defend and despite what anyone says about McKenna he can't coach defenders, he's f**king useless at it because the same errors happen again and again and again, clueless.

Then how many times do we kill our own momentum when breaking forward all second half, so bloody laboured it's ridiculous, I also question the coaching of putting the ball in the bloody box, as Robbie Savage said its so often we don't cross the bloody ball, actually fuming tonight, I expected a heavy defeat and yet we could and probably should have won tonight, they are woeful and Ten bloody men !!!

Clarke pointless, Tuanzebe was a liability, wtf was Morsy thinking with the OG for God sake ! We're actually bloody crap, for all the pretty bits the nitty gritty is hopeless. I'm just sick of it all.

[The Odious Mr Rossi]

Firstly, I agree with Liz - McKenna is a f**king idiot.

About the game, well, its a really first class example of a team coming out for the 2nd half - level but with the momentum and a man to the good - and not only throwing the game but creating next to nothing.

Despite all of the bollox we have read game after game about lessons having been learned, in 27 PL games the players, it seems, have learned absolutely sod-all, and neither has McKenna.

[The Odious Mr Rossi]

I don't need to wait for the post-match interview, I know what KM will say.................
"I thought we played very well for the majority of the game against a quality team, and we deserved at least a draw. It's always difficult playing against 10 men. At the end of the day, some silly defensive mistakes cost us, but we were very unlucky. It's all down to fine margins, and this season all the fine margins have gone against us sob sob.
".

[Blue Wilf]

Well we let them off the hook tonight. Fans were brilliant as usual but the team just did not fire. We went 1-0 through a lucky break but then looked like we may extend the lead as Its were so poor. Delap seemed to play deep for some reason, I am sick of philogene and clarke as they offer nothing. Lots of tippy tappy and zero end product, no pace, no penetration. Sad to sag that Morsy too looks tired, slow and out of his depth in this league. Defensively we are poor, midfield we are non existent, we have zero pace and zero attacking threat. McKenna has run out of ideas and remains intransigent. We are down all bar the shouting and we deserve to be. Happier days will return in the championship I am sure and it holds no fear for me - only a hope for excitement. I said I would hate the PL in posts last season but would give it a chance. Well - I hate it and all it stands for. Man utd stands emptied with 15 mins to go and they didn't make a squeak until they scored their third goal. Plastic fans, sh*t refs, overpaid primadonna players. They can shove it where the sun don't shine.

To all of you who follow the process etc, good luck with it cos it has failed. We need a reset and until then, we will continue to blow hot and cold. I could criticise KMc again but whats the point? He did what he has done all season and that is the problem but many on here don't see it. Well, lets see what happens but my money is on him making a swift exit once the manager merry go round starts in the summer - I will be hugely ever thankful for all he did for us but won't shed a tear when he goes. He has taken us as far as he can and we need anfresh impetus now.

[Blue Wilf]

One other point of note... I have been at old trafford in their glory days and seen some of their legends play here and then on into the class of 92 etc. what I saw tonight was a sorry, sorry shadow of any of those teams. They are inept and bereft of talent or passion. It is actually a bit sad to see but is their problem. We have our own to fix.

[Mach_Polish_Blue]

I expected a hard, difficult season. Never have I expected though to be an embarrassment. Unfortunately we are an embarrassment and laughing stock.

For the first time ever I am seriously angry with McKenna. He is from the same school of managers/coaches as Russell Martin. Not wanting/willing to adapt, to be flexible.

Every bloody single time whether we win/draw/lose when our goalkeeper grabs the ball he allows opposition to come back and regroup and then we start walking with the ball. That was the case even against 10 men today. Against the worst Man Utd for 50 years.

Spent the entire second half passing the ball sideways. There was only one shot from Philogene which was an easy save. Apart from that Onana had very little to do.
We should have been tearing into them. Get second striker early on. But no, it was all about McKenna's beliefs and walking football.

Three goals from set pieces. Well, Mark Hudson is our set pieces coach

McKenna's tactics got us promoted twice and that will never be forgotten but these tactics don't work in the Prem. He doesn't have a clue what to do other than stick to his beliefs.

Jack Taylor said this week: 'we aren't going to change our ways'. There you go. If that is the case Premier League isn't a place for us.

90+ min and Szmodics on Wow, what was the point of doing it so late?

It was painful for me on the tram back (as I live on the other side of city) to listen to what Man Utd fans were saying about us. Shyte and hopeless.

Again, McKenna's journey with us will never be forgotten but as things stand he is completely out of his depth in the Premier League.

[ITFC2024]

I’ve been a fan of KM, but my support is diminishing. In a must win game, he omits Townsend and employs two lightweights in the form of Philogene/Clarke. Yes I can hear the arguments now, Philogene got two goals! Two lucky goals, am I right? He and Clarke did f*ck all the rest of the match.

Cajuste was MOM for me. He was always trying to make something happen. If Szmodics & Broadhead were fit, why not start with them?

Sorry I’m sure Marko will chastise me with the ands/ifs and buts…but?

[Shed on tour]

Well that was worth getting soaked for, NOT. That 2nd half performance was abysmal, we are so slow in moving the ball it is a joke. Missing my first away of the season next Monday and tbh at this moment in time I couldn’t care less and the sooner this season ends the better.

[arana peligrosa]

With the defense we got and McKennas tactics with it, there's really little hope in expecting to survive this season. Teams like Southampton and LCFC are making it easier for us or providing a helping hand week in week out but we ourselves just aren't good enough to hope to retain top league status. Its only one relegation place to avoid but f*ck it have seen enough now to accept we're most likely going to be the ones to fill it.

The opposition are crap plain and simple. A better team can or will take points from them at their own venue however once again defensive errors were prevalent on our part and the manager seemed once again to indulge in a number of costly oversights. Palmer did good despite the defeat but there were names on the bench like Szmodics that should have been introduced before they were.

Pleased to score two goals there, years back it would have been a feat and a half but now and simple fact we got beat by a poor opposition team, yet again defense inconsistencies and a manager who rightly or wrongly just can't cut it at the highest level. Their player that was dismissed, nasty challenge, there's no place for that in the game but even with 10 men we should have taken something from the contest.

What really kills it, being other teams handing on a plate a way to survive this league but more often than not we just can't seem to help ourselves. Disappointing ratshit but still time and games available to save it. Too many goals conceding however, that's what will cost us.

[ATB]

I’ve been a fan of KM, but my support is diminishing. In a must win game, he omits Townsend and employs two lightweights in the form of Philogene/Clarke. Yes I can hear the arguments now, Philogene got two goals! Two lucky goals, am I right? He and Clarke did f*ck all the rest of the match.

Cajuste was MOM for me. He was always trying to make something happen. If Szmodics & Broadhead were fit, why not start with them?

Sorry I’m sure Marko will chastise me with the ands/ifs and buts…but?

Cajuste was at complete fault for the 3rd goal

I’m a big fan of his typically but I thought whilst he did some good things there were actually a lot of errors in his game.

Philogene was being praised by the commentators for being the biggest attacking threat and also defending. I thought he did well but still looks way too relaxed. He needs urgency. Even the way he scored the first one looked like he was strolling.

I also thought Clarke was decent in the first half.

We need the energy and passion of Szmodics and Chaplin. There was no heart in that second half. It was depressing to watch.

[Charnwood]

Two lucky goals, ManU down to 10 men and we can’t even get a fuckin draw! Useless Harry McGuire scores the winner! Can’t wait ‘til we go down. I’m tired of this sh*t.

A big problem for us was that Harry McGuire isn’t useless in fact he’s currently probably Man United’s best player and is playing fantastically well at both ends of the pitch whereas we have central defenders that aren’t good at either end.

Harry McGuire clears almost every arial ball that comes anywhere near him in his own area and is a massive threat for their arial attack at set pieces from which in the past three weeks he’s scored the winning goals against Leicester City and ourselves.

We could certainly do with Harry McGuire if similar to bolster up our team.

[Bluemike]

I’ve been a fan of KM, but my support is diminishing. In a must win game, he omits Townsend and employs two lightweights in the form of Philogene/Clarke. Yes I can hear the arguments now, Philogene got two goals! Two lucky goals, am I right? He and Clarke did f*ck all the rest of the match.

Cajuste was MOM for me. He was always trying to make something happen. If Szmodics & Broadhead were fit, why not start with them?

Sorry I’m sure Marko will chastise me with the ands/ifs and buts…but?

I thought Philogene was our best player 1st half, that says it all, woeful after the break as were all of them, at the end of the day it's pointless singling out individual players cus collectively the squad assembled is Championship standard with the exception of Delap and even he is a kid still learning in reality.

[Bluemike]

I expected a hard, difficult season. Never have I expected though to be an embarrassment. Unfortunately we are an embarrassment and laughing stock.

For the first time ever I am seriously angry with McKenna. He is from the same school of managers/coaches as Russell Martin. Not wanting/willing to adapt, to be flexible.

Every bloody single time whether we win/draw/lose when our goalkeeper grabs the ball he allows opposition to come back and regroup and then we start walking with the ball. That was the case even against 10 men today. Against the worst Man Utd for 50 years.

Spent the entire second half passing the ball sideways. There was only one shot from Philogene which was an easy save. Apart from that Onana had very little to do.
We should have been tearing into them. Get second striker early on. But no, it was all about McKenna's beliefs and walking football.

Three goals from set pieces. Well, Mark Hudson is our set pieces coach

McKenna's tactics got us promoted twice and that will never be forgotten but these tactics don't work in the Prem. He doesn't have a clue what to do other than stick to his beliefs.

Jack Taylor said this week: 'we aren't going to change our ways'. There you go. If that is the case Premier League isn't a place for us.

90+ min and Szmodics on Wow, what was the point of doing it so late?

It was painful for me on the tram back (as I live on the other side of city) to listen to what Man Utd fans were saying about us. Shyte and hopeless.

Again, McKenna's journey with us will never be forgotten but as things stand he is completely out of his depth in the Premier League.

We'd be better off with Rock Hudson or Katie Hudson.

[marko69]

I’ve been a fan of KM, but my support is diminishing. In a must win game, he omits Townsend and employs two lightweights in the form of Philogene/Clarke. Yes I can hear the arguments now, Philogene got two goals! Two lucky goals, am I right? He and Clarke did f*ck all the rest of the match.

Cajuste was MOM for me. He was always trying to make something happen. If Szmodics & Broadhead were fit, why not start with them?

Sorry I’m sure Marko will chastise me with the ands/ifs and buts…but?

Not at all, 24. At some point you just got leave the homegrown fans to it. And rightly so.
Resorted to reading (with interest as always) and just going to watch how it all pans out.

[marko69]

We need the energy and passion of Szmodics and Chaplin.

100%

[The Odious Mr Rossi]

Having now watched KM's post match interview, at least he admitted that we were terrible 2nd half, although there were the usual sayings that I had expected especially saying that lessons will be learned.

One thing he said, however, made me smile:
"Their two centre-forwards were stronger than us on long balls and we weren’t able to get any foothold in the game".

The clue is in that statement, Kieron - why havn't you tried it? Is it outside your comfort zone?

[Shed on tour]

Before the season started Ashton said we were not in the Prem just to make up the numbers. Unfortunately that is how it has turned out and McKenna has to take some of the blame for that for failing to attempt to try something different and sticking to the same thing week after week.
As for next season in the Championship I think things could be a lot more difficult than some think as we no longer will be the surprise package like last year but a target instead. Time will tell.

[Charnwood]

I’ve been a fan of KM, but my support is diminishing. In a must win game, he omits Townsend and employs two lightweights in the form of Philogene/Clarke. Yes I can hear the arguments now, Philogene got two goals! Two lucky goals, am I right? He and Clarke did f*ck all the rest of the match.

Cajuste was MOM for me. He was always trying to make something happen. If Szmodics & Broadhead were fit, why not start with them?

Sorry I’m sure Marko will chastise me with the ands/ifs and buts…but?

I thought Philogene was our best player 1st half, that says it all, woeful after the break as were all of them, at the end of the day it's pointless singling out individual players cus collectively the squad assembled is Championship standard with the exception of Delap and even he is a kid still learning in reality.

…and there in lies the problem Mike. I don’t blame our owners, Mark Ashton, Kieron McKenna or the players for our current situation and potential relegation. I blame the structure of English football which has driven a huge wedge between the Premier League and the Championship, so huge that when clubs are promoted to the top tier, with the FFP restrictions in place it’s impossible to bridge the gap.
Even the most successful Championship clubs promoted are restricted to circa £100m spending the year immediately following promotion, which means buying any experienced EPL players is out of the question which leaves you limited to buying the best Championship players available. This is exactly what we did and it doesn’t work, because whilst we do this the existing Premier League clubs are spending equal amounts and more strengthening their own squads in the same transfer window meaning the gap between the two divisions widens every year. In the last three seasons I think the gap has become unbridgeable unless you do what Forest did and ignore it and take the risk that it pays off.
I think we have to accept that we’re playing in the Premier League with way inferior players to 17 other teams and given our double promotions we may well have the weakest squad in the league. Despite this we are competing and we are having a go and at times playing entertaining stuff, unfortunately it’s only in short bursts and we don’t have the quality of players to maintain it.
Baring a miracle it looks to me like all three promoted clubs will be relegated again with a similar low points tally to the three relegated teams last season. I don’t think this is a reflection on the football clubs, their managers or their players, it’s simply a consequence of the elite structure of the Premier League that makes it impossible for outsiders to infiltrate. I’m not sure what the solution is because as it stands it may as well become a franchised football league that sits apart from the English Football League.
Maybe we should have a separate thread to debate what the solution looks like.

[hallamblue]

WORD



However it still doesn't explain McKenna's reluctance to play his more experienced players.

[Bluemike]

Yes Andy, that's pretty much it in a nutshell although for me there are still things that had we done them differently we wouldn't have lost certain games and we'd still have a fighting chance.

[marko69]

…and there in lies the problem Mike. I don’t blame our owners, Mark Ashton, Kieron McKenna or the players for our current situation and potential relegation. I blame the structure of English football which has driven a huge wedge between the Premier League and the Championship, so huge that when clubs are promoted to the top tier, with the FFP restrictions in place it’s impossible to bridge the gap.
Even the most successful Championship clubs promoted are restricted to circa £100m spending the year immediately following promotion, which means buying any experienced EPL players is out of the question which leaves you limited to buying the best Championship players available. This is exactly what we did and it doesn’t work, because whilst we do this the existing Premier League clubs are spending equal amounts and more strengthening their own squads in the same transfer window meaning the gap between the two divisions widens every year. In the last three seasons I think the gap has become unbridgeable unless you do what Forest did and ignore it and take the risk that it pays off.
I think we have to accept that we’re playing in the Premier League with way inferior players to 17 other teams and given our double promotions we may well have the weakest squad in the league. Despite this we are competing and we are having a go and at times playing entertaining stuff, unfortunately it’s only in short bursts and we don’t have the quality of players to maintain it.
Baring a miracle it looks to me like all three promoted clubs will be relegated again with a similar low points tally to the three relegated teams last season. I don’t think this is a reflection on the football clubs, their managers or their players, it’s simply a consequence of the elite structure of the Premier League that makes it impossible for outsiders to infiltrate. I’m not sure what the solution is because as it stands it may as well become a franchised football league that sits apart from the English Football League.
Maybe we should have a separate thread to debate what the solution looks like.

Going to add “perfect” to the WORD saying.

Word perfect , Charnwood.

[Charnwood]

Yes Andy, that's pretty much it in a nutshell although for me there are still things that had we done them differently we wouldn't have lost certain games and we'd still have a fighting chance.

…. and we still could Mike if we could tighten our defence for starters. I know Muric was a disaster but what shows even more now we have Palmer between the posts is that the defenders in front of the keeper are absolutely shocking and nowhere near Premier League standard.
If we could get any sort of rythem going and beat Wolves at Portman Road it may not take too many points to finish above Wolves.
I still think if we could survive this season and have another year strengthening the team we could be a mid table Premier League team within a couple of seasons. The problem is surviving the first year which the current rules make almost impossible.
If the EPL choose to flex their muscles and make an example of Man City we could just drop lucky which is another reason why we have to stay above Leicester and Southampton.

[ITFC2024]

I’ve been a fan of KM, but my support is diminishing. In a must win game, he omits Townsend and employs two lightweights in the form of Philogene/Clarke. Yes I can hear the arguments now, Philogene got two goals! Two lucky goals, am I right? He and Clarke did f*ck all the rest of the match.

Cajuste was MOM for me. He was always trying to make something happen. If Szmodics & Broadhead were fit, why not start with them?

Sorry I’m sure Marko will chastise me with the ands/ifs and buts…but?

Cajuste was at complete fault for the 3rd goal

I’m a big fan of his typically but I thought whilst he did some good things there were actually a lot of errors in his game.

Philogene was being praised by the commentators for being the biggest attacking threat and also defending. I thought he did well but still looks way too relaxed. He needs urgency. Even the way he scored the first one looked like he was strolling.

I also thought Clarke was decent in the first half.

We need the energy and passion of Szmodics and Chaplin. There was no heart in that second half. It was depressing to watch.

Cajuste made a couple surging runs in attack instead of the typical passing from side to side and backwards. Philogene typically passed the ball backwards and his few crosses were poor.

Clarke did nothing for me. He just passed the ball sideways. No surging runs. No shots on goal. No assists for shots on goal.

[ITFC2024]

Yes Andy, that's pretty much it in a nutshell although for me there are still things that had we done them differently we wouldn't have lost certain games and we'd still have a fighting chance.

Absolutely! Without the silly mistakes by a goalie and some defenders along with the inexperience of KM, we would be in the safe zone.

[hallamblue]

Watching bits of WHU vs Leicester tonight and Leicester look a spent force....reminds me of us last night. I'd go so far as to say the bottom three appear to have accepted their fate.

They really can shove the Premier League, its really isn't worth it.

[Blue Wilf]

Yes Andy, that's pretty much it in a nutshell although for me there are still things that had we done them differently we wouldn't have lost certain games and we'd still have a fighting chance.

…. and we still could Mike if we could tighten our defence for starters. I know Muric was a disaster but what shows even more now we have Palmer between the posts is that the defenders in front of the keeper are absolutely shocking and nowhere near Premier League standard.
If we could get any sort of rythem going and beat Wolves at Portman Road it may not take too many points to finish above Wolves.
I still think if we could survive this season and have another year strengthening the team we could be a mid table Premier League team within a couple of seasons. The problem is surviving the first year which the current rules make almost impossible.
If the EPL choose to flex their muscles and make an example of Man City we could just drop lucky which is another reason why we have to stay above Leicester and Southampton.

Football is killing itself and has been for some time. To expect the global desire for games to continue when the local following of teams diminishes is not sustainable. We already have grounds full of foreign 'supporters' who just want an instagram pic of them at a game (Spurs away was a particular wake up call for me in this regard) that it kills atmosphere and the passion is just not there. Much of this is cultural as those of us brought up with traditional english (and scottish) football backgrounds are being priced out or choose not to attend for one reason or another. It is very sad indeed. However, our own fate could have been different and whilst I agree with much of Charnwood's post, our reality could have been different and I absolutely believe that much of that is KM's fault. I know that is not a popular view but it is one I stand behind. We could have survived but wrong choices were made (last night included). Yes it is very hard and the gap widens but it is not impossible to bridge.