Please Observe,

[goldandblack]

A minutes silence will be observed at all next weekend Premier League
games in honour of Liverpool’s disallowed goal,

The first time in history of VAR being wrong,
Our thoughts go to the victims, Liverpool FC.

[Bluemike]

Always the victim

[Andym]

I’m not a fan of VAR, as it hasn’t had the effect I hoped it would.
But I think in all this fuss, some people have missed the point. The official ruled the goal offside (incorrectly). So without VAR it still would have been disallowed. Yes, VAR messed up, but only after the official had got it wrong. That was the original error. Scrapping VAR wouldn’t have changed the decision.
What I really hoped for with VAR was that it would stop the diving. But it hasn’t; if there’s a bit of contact in the penalty area and the player trips over his laces, it is still given as a penalty. It hasn’t stopped the lottery of whether it’s a handball if the ball hits a player’s arm. Attempts to clarify the law by describing the offence in more detail have only led to a different type of handball; it used to be that the action had to be deliberate. These days, if you jump (remembering it is hard to jump without raising an arm) then you are in danger of conceding a penalty.
But the most ludicrous is the drawing of lines across the pitch for offside decisions. The offside law was introduced to stop goal hanging. It was to stop players gaining an advantage. If you need to draw lines to see whether one player’s toenail is further forward than another player’s shoulder, then there is clearly no advantage. So stop holding up the game and accept its a tight enough decision to go with the original verdict.
We need to accept that some decisions aren’t clear cut. It is down to the referee’s interpretation.

[rossi]

I’m not a fan of VAR, as it hasn’t had the effect I hoped it would.
But I think in all this fuss, some people have missed the point. The official ruled the goal offside (incorrectly). So without VAR it still would have been disallowed. Yes, VAR messed up, but only after the official had got it wrong. That was the original error. Scrapping VAR wouldn’t have changed the decision.
What I really hoped for with VAR was that it would stop the diving. But it hasn’t; if there’s a bit of contact in the penalty area and the player trips over his laces, it is still given as a penalty. It hasn’t stopped the lottery of whether it’s a handball if the ball hits a player’s arm. Attempts to clarify the law by describing the offence in more detail have only led to a different type of handball; it used to be that the action had to be deliberate. These days, if you jump (remembering it is hard to jump without raising an arm) then you are in danger of conceding a penalty.
But the most ludicrous is the drawing of lines across the pitch for offside decisions. The offside law was introduced to stop goal hanging. It was to stop players gaining an advantage. If you need to draw lines to see whether one player’s toenail is further forward than another player’s shoulder, then there is clearly no advantage. So stop holding up the game and accept its a tight enough decision to go with the original verdict.
We need to accept that some decisions aren’t clear cut. It is down to the referee’s interpretation.

Agree completely. In this case, the VAR and his assistant have both been stood down.
But what about the bungling incompetent idiot who gave the decision in the first place? FFS, he was level with play and close to it, yet he still gave an incorrect decision. He should never be allowed to officiate at a gamer again.

[marko69]

A minutes silence will be observed at all next weekend Premier League
games in honour of Liverpool’s disallowed goal.

[goldandblack]

I’m not a fan of VAR, as it hasn’t had the effect I hoped it would.
But I think in all this fuss, some people have missed the point. The official ruled the goal offside (incorrectly). So without VAR it still would have been disallowed. Yes, VAR messed up, but only after the official had got it wrong. That was the original error. Scrapping VAR wouldn’t have changed the decision.
What I really hoped for with VAR was that it would stop the diving. But it hasn’t; if there’s a bit of contact in the penalty area and the player trips over his laces, it is still given as a penalty. It hasn’t stopped the lottery of whether it’s a handball if the ball hits a player’s arm. Attempts to clarify the law by describing the offence in more detail have only led to a different type of handball; it used to be that the action had to be deliberate. These days, if you jump (remembering it is hard to jump without raising an arm) then you are in danger of conceding a penalty.
But the most ludicrous is the drawing of lines across the pitch for offside decisions. The offside law was introduced to stop goal hanging. It was to stop players gaining an advantage. If you need to draw lines to see whether one player’s toenail is further forward than another player’s shoulder, then there is clearly no advantage. So stop holding up the game and accept its a tight enough decision to go with the original verdict.
We need to accept that some decisions aren’t clear cut. It is down to the referee’s interpretation.

Agree with a lot of that Andy BUT

The whole idea of VAR was to prove without doubt decisions to make are correct without human errors .Well that's what we were told?
The lines are there to show exactly what decision to make. They can’t be wrong can they?
Its all there in black and white, ii they cant make the right call after 3 mins how can officials make them in a split second,

With all these new rules on the off-side, hand ball etc.etc. The officials must find it tough watching everything, especially the off side, all these phase 1 phase 2 stuff, almost impossible

So decisions cannot be wrong by VAR, unless of course it’s against the BIG Box office clubs, wonder what Klippity Klopp and LiVARpool have done to upset the establishment.

To me VAR was put in place to make sure any decision goes in favour of certain clubs, as the Town will find out when they reach this corrupt league.

3. Q. What is the difference between a battery and a Scouser?
A. A battery has a positive side.

[valleyroad]

I’m not a fan of VAR, as it hasn’t had the effect I hoped it would.
But I think in all this fuss, some people have missed the point. The official ruled the goal offside (incorrectly). So without VAR it still would have been disallowed. Yes, VAR messed up, but only after the official had got it wrong. That was the original error. Scrapping VAR wouldn’t have changed the decision.
What I really hoped for with VAR was that it would stop the diving. But it hasn’t; if there’s a bit of contact in the penalty area and the player trips over his laces, it is still given as a penalty. It hasn’t stopped the lottery of whether it’s a handball if the ball hits a player’s arm. Attempts to clarify the law by describing the offence in more detail have only led to a different type of handball; it used to be that the action had to be deliberate. These days, if you jump (remembering it is hard to jump without raising an arm) then you are in danger of conceding a penalty.
But the most ludicrous is the drawing of lines across the pitch for offside decisions. The offside law was introduced to stop goal hanging. It was to stop players gaining an advantage. If you need to draw lines to see whether one player’s toenail is further forward than another player’s shoulder, then there is clearly no advantage. So stop holding up the game and accept its a tight enough decision to go with the original verdict.
We need to accept that some decisions aren’t clear cut. It is down to the referee’s interpretation.

Agree completely. In this case, the VAR and his assistant have both been stood down.
But what about the bungling incompetent idiot who gave the decision in the first place? FFS, he was level with play and close to it, yet he still gave an incorrect decision. He should never be allowed to officiate at a gamer again.

I bet you have never ran a line in your life.
I have many many times and would prefer to be in the middle refereeing every single time.
The higher up the grades you go the harder it becomes as the speed and cleverness of player at top level is beyond what any fan has a clue about.
The guy in not an bungling incompetent idiot as you as usually so foolishly put it, he is human and prone to error.

The VAR process completely failed in this instance and will be a major learning factor for all concerned.

For me VAR is good. Negatives are with time taken to reach a decision and lack of comms with crowd. We only ever hear about it when something goes wrong.

The one major area that VAR has been a complete nonsense is the handball rule. It has been a complete disaster and leads to farcical decisions with players now in a ridiculous situation of going into tackles with hands behind back etc. I'd put that back in the hands of referees and back to in the opnion of the referee. I'd let VAR intervene for a major error like the Thierry Henry handball against Ireland etc.

[rossi]

I’m not a fan of VAR, as it hasn’t had the effect I hoped it would.
But I think in all this fuss, some people have missed the point. The official ruled the goal offside (incorrectly). So without VAR it still would have been disallowed. Yes, VAR messed up, but only after the official had got it wrong. That was the original error. Scrapping VAR wouldn’t have changed the decision.
What I really hoped for with VAR was that it would stop the diving. But it hasn’t; if there’s a bit of contact in the penalty area and the player trips over his laces, it is still given as a penalty. It hasn’t stopped the lottery of whether it’s a handball if the ball hits a player’s arm. Attempts to clarify the law by describing the offence in more detail have only led to a different type of handball; it used to be that the action had to be deliberate. These days, if you jump (remembering it is hard to jump without raising an arm) then you are in danger of conceding a penalty.
But the most ludicrous is the drawing of lines across the pitch for offside decisions. The offside law was introduced to stop goal hanging. It was to stop players gaining an advantage. If you need to draw lines to see whether one player’s toenail is further forward than another player’s shoulder, then there is clearly no advantage. So stop holding up the game and accept its a tight enough decision to go with the original verdict.
We need to accept that some decisions aren’t clear cut. It is down to the referee’s interpretation.

Agree completely. In this case, the VAR and his assistant have both been stood down.
But what about the bungling incompetent idiot who gave the decision in the first place? FFS, he was level with play and close to it, yet he still gave an incorrect decision. He should never be allowed to officiate at a gamer again.

I bet you have never ran a line in your life.
I have many many times and would prefer to be in the middle refereeing every single time.
The higher up the grades you go the harder it becomes as the speed and cleverness of player at top level is beyond what any fan has a clue about.
The guy in not an bungling incompetent idiot as you as usually so foolishly put it, he is human and prone to error.

The VAR process completely failed in this instance and will be a major learning factor for all concerned.

For me VAR is good. Negatives are with time taken to reach a decision and lack of comms with crowd. We only ever hear about it when something goes wrong.

The one major area that VAR has been a complete nonsense is the handball rule. It has been a complete disaster and leads to farcical decisions with players now in a ridiculous situation of going into tackles with hands behind back etc. I'd put that back in the hands of referees and back to in the opnion of the referee. I'd let VAR intervene for a major error like the Thierry Henry handball against Ireland etc.

- then you've lost your bet, pal: you know nothing about me so don't make ridiculous unfounded assumptions

- it's far more foolish to make unfounded assumptions than it is to make an observation

[valleyroad]

Agree completely. In this case, the VAR and his assistant have both been stood down.
But what about the bungling incompetent idiot who gave the decision in the first place? FFS, he was level with play and close to it, yet he still gave an incorrect decision. He should never be allowed to officiate at a gamer again.

I bet you have never ran a line in your life.
I have many many times and would prefer to be in the middle refereeing every single time.
The higher up the grades you go the harder it becomes as the speed and cleverness of player at top level is beyond what any fan has a clue about.
The guy in not an bungling incompetent idiot as you as usually so foolishly put it, he is human and prone to error.

The VAR process completely failed in this instance and will be a major learning factor for all concerned.

For me VAR is good. Negatives are with time taken to reach a decision and lack of comms with crowd. We only ever hear about it when something goes wrong.

The one major area that VAR has been a complete nonsense is the handball rule. It has been a complete disaster and leads to farcical decisions with players now in a ridiculous situation of going into tackles with hands behind back etc. I'd put that back in the hands of referees and back to in the opnion of the referee. I'd let VAR intervene for a major error like the Thierry Henry handball against Ireland etc.

- then you've lost your bet, pal: you know nothing about me so don't make ridiculous unfounded assumptions

- it's far more foolish to make unfounded assumptions than it is to make an observation

Oh so you are a qualified referee now ? What you ran the line in a village football game ?
If you were a qualified referee and had ran the line at a significant level then you wouldn't be making the uneducated comments you are making and if you have then they are disgraceful

[Mauswara]

Referees and linesmen have always made sh*te calls. 50% of the time.

[Dubai Blue]

I'm a big fan of VAR and I'm happy with the improvement that it has made to the game. I'm happy to accept a little bit of nonsense for all of those major bloopers onfield that have now been (mostly) prevented.

The Liverpool issue wasn't with VAR other in that the official behind the screen was totally incompetent in his communication. That is the learning here, that the officials need to give clear and unambiguous comments when required to do so. Of course once in a blue moon we can get flustered, we all do, and that just shows that even when introducing technology, there can be human error.

Personally this should be a simple issue to replace the humans with AI. Offside rulings are the most obvious and easiest decisions to introduce AI since they are very much black and white. The results would be known very fast too. The ref can get a haptic offside warning even before the shot is taken, so effectively in play. AI is so reliable that we wouldn't even need the bother of replays, making the game continuous once again.

Actually while I'm riffing, the haptic response could actually go to the linesman, so he could raise the flag only when signalled to do so. Then no need for any VAR reviews for offside ever again.

[Bluemike]

How long before we replace the players with AI ?? It'll happen one day.

[marko69]

Believe it or not, AI gets stuff wrong. In fact, AI gets A LOT wrong.
Go on the AI thing and fire questions at it, (questions you know the answer to) ….. you’ll be shocked.
And you type…… “Sorry, but thats just wrong”…… and it replies, “I do apologise for this, i will try harder.”

Whats the fkn point.

Best example……. My grandaughter asking it what The Bionic Man was.

“Bionic Man was an astronaut who suffered near fatal injury. He was rebuilt with Bionic circuitry, two legs, right arm, left eye and left ear.”

I said to her. “He didnt have a bionic left ear.”

She typed that in.

“Sorry, I do apologise. Right ear.”

“He didnt have ANY bionic ears ”

She typed that in.

“I do apologise. You are correct. Only legs, one arm and one eye.”

—————


THAT WASNT OFFSIDE, AI ???

“I do apologise. You are correct. It wasn’t. My bad. Get it up ye anyway. You bucket raking tosser.”

Ok, who’s programming the VAR AI ?

[Bluemike]

"That wasn't offside, AI ??"

AI REPLIES. " Yes it was, he's a Liverpool tw*t"

[goldandblack]

I might be bias but to me VAR was brought in to make sure important decisions at important times to safeguard the Box Office ticket selling clubs on fee paying channels,
Why would they put millions and millions into clubs? Its not to watch the likes of Wolves, Brighton etc in Europe
Why can the big 6 buy as many players for 100s of millions when other cant?, its blatant to see why. these top clubs click there fingers and buy anyone they want from the fodder clubs,

The whole reason for FFP has nothing to do with safeguarding clubs finances as put forward by Corrupt FIFA..
https://www.90min.com/posts/financial-f ... -explained .

I agree with Valleyroad on the ref and linesmen situation they have been put in, if VAR can’t see easy decisions in 3mins how can an official see it in a split second, the new offside rules are impossible for the officials,
The whole set up stinks,
Brighton and us bucked the trend, but VAR decisions have made certain we didn’t do it again, or come close to it again,Brighton will find this out this season,

Town fans will realise I’m not to far off when they get back in the Premier,
Watch this space,

[goldandblack]

Believe it or not, AI gets stuff wrong. In fact, AI gets A LOT wrong.
Go on the AI thing and fire questions at it, (questions you know the answer to) ….. you’ll be shocked.
And you type…… “Sorry, but thats just wrong”…… and it replies, “I do apologise for this, i will try harder.”

Whats the fkn point.

Best example……. My grandaughter asking it what The Bionic Man was.

“Bionic Man was an astronaut who suffered near fatal injury. He was rebuilt with Bionic circuitry, two legs, right arm, left eye and left ear.”

I said to her. “He didnt have a bionic left ear.”

She typed that in.

“Sorry, I do apologise. Right ear.”

“He didnt have ANY bionic ears ”

She typed that in.

“I do apologise. You are correct. Only legs, one arm and one eye.”

—————


THAT WASNT OFFSIDE, AI ???

“I do apologise. You are correct. It wasn’t. My bad. Get it up ye anyway. You bucket raking tosser.”

Ok, who’s programming the VAR AI ?

gone are the days of telling the grandchildren made up answers, Aunty Google ruined all that,
Grandkids " do yo remember telling us this and that, Well looked it up and your wrong."
Grandad, " you sure i said that"
funny how they never question Nan's on her answers then again nor would I.

[Dubai Blue]

I know you're half joking about AI above but remember the thing about AI is that is learns from its mistakes with no human bias. Already it is diagnosing cancers and making mission critical decisions. Yeah the coffee table stuff that we play with is not the most advanced AI and we can try to reassure ourselves that we humans will not be replaced by it but that ship has already sailed. If a decent amount of effort is spent on it AI for offside could be implemented just the way I described, really quickly. And the cost would be irrelevant for Premier League sides.

[goldandblack]

I know you're half joking about AI above but remember the thing about AI is that is learns from its mistakes with no human bias. Already it is diagnosing cancers and making mission critical decisions. Yeah the coffee table stuff that we play with is not the most advanced AI and we can try to reassure ourselves that we humans will not be replaced by it but that ship has already sailed. If a decent amount of effort is spent on it AI for offside could be implemented just the way I described, really quickly. And the cost would be irrelevant for Premier League sides.

That all sounds great Dubai Blue although lost me with all this IT stuff. but cant see that ever happening if FIFA have anything to do with it,
they need all the decisions in there grubby little hands,

[marko69]

Football Commentator: " Well, here we are in the 97th minute of normal time in the Champions League Final @ Wembley Stadium, its 1-1, and the penalty decision has gone to VAR. The crowd awaits in anticipation. This is huge. Historic. And we are witnessing it. And here it is, VAR over the loudspeaker system. Whats it to be......"

VAR: "Decision: The Bionic Man didn't have Bionic ears."

"Well, Ally, what can you say about that?"

McCoist; "And the ref hasn't got bionic eyes either....., the feckin blind bstd"

"Still On Air, Ally, still On Air."

----------------
Joking OF COURSE, Dubai....., but I'll guess lightyears away from AI making decisions in the football.

[goldandblack]

just a few of the corrupt decisions , many more but you get the jist,

Liverpool v Wolves FA Cup.
On 0.35.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYLdki2Fu9E
………………………………………………………………………….
Manchester United vs Wolves
0m 3.29
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bNQKyvDOV0
………………………………………..
Liverpool win after VAR controversy! | Liverpool 1-0 Wolves | Premier League Highlights

on 1.01.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qG1lIIj9_fU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5J4v_gpwNbg
……………………………………………………………….
Burley 1 v Wolves 1
‘CLOUD CUCKOO LAND!’ Craig Burley lays into VAR for Burnley’s late penalty vs. Wolves
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhp8d4ZZyGc
................................................................
Luton Wolves,
on 2.31
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugJuxJ2E-o8

[goldandblack]

Football Commentator: " Well, here we are in the 97th minute of normal time in the Champions League Final @ Wembley Stadium, its 1-1, and the penalty decision has gone to VAR. The crowd awaits in anticipation. This is huge. Historic. And we are witnessing it. And here it is, VAR over the loudspeaker system. Whats it to be......"

VAR: "Decision: The Bionic Man didn't have Bionic ears."

"Well, Ally, what can you say about that?"

McCoist; "And the ref hasn't got bionic eyes either....., the feckin blind bstd"

"Still On Air, Ally, still On Air."

----------------
Joking OF COURSE, Dubai....., but I'll guess lightyears away from AI making decisions in the football.

What do you think of that McCoist, to me he's a total waste of pixels on the telly.

[rossi]

Oh so you are a qualified referee now ? What you ran the line in a village football game ?
If you were a qualified referee and had ran the line at a significant level then you wouldn't be making the uneducated comments you are making and if you have then they are disgraceful

Me? Un-educated? Ha, like I said earlier, you don't know me at all.

As for your opinion - well, you are entitlerd to it of course, but I don't much care for your opinions (never have done, actually) so will happily go on with my day regardless

[marko69]

Football Commentator: " Well, here we are in the 97th minute of normal time in the Champions League Final @ Wembley Stadium, its 1-1, and the penalty decision has gone to VAR. The crowd awaits in anticipation. This is huge. Historic. And we are witnessing it. And here it is, VAR over the loudspeaker system. Whats it to be......"

VAR: "Decision: The Bionic Man didn't have Bionic ears."

"Well, Ally, what can you say about that?"

McCoist; "And the ref hasn't got bionic eyes either....., the feckin blind bstd"

"Still On Air, Ally, still On Air."

----------------
Joking OF COURSE, Dubai....., but I'll guess lightyears away from AI making decisions in the football.

What do you think of that McCoist, to me he's a total waste of pixels on the telly.

Coisty is ok. He always looks at things from a more positive angle which i personally warm too.

Coisty or Sutton? ……. Super Ally every day of the week.

Edit to add: He was also very congratulatory towards Hibernian in 2016 after the cup win. Unlike all the other twisted faced media. I mean no doubt he had a few unsavoury words behind closed doors but thats across the board.

[goldandblack]

Football Commentator: " Well, here we are in the 97th minute of normal time in the Champions League Final @ Wembley Stadium, its 1-1, and the penalty decision has gone to VAR. The crowd awaits in anticipation. This is huge. Historic. And we are witnessing it. And here it is, VAR over the loudspeaker system. Whats it to be......"

VAR: "Decision: The Bionic Man didn't have Bionic ears."

"Well, Ally, what can you say about that?"

McCoist; "And the ref hasn't got bionic eyes either....., the feckin blind bstd"

"Still On Air, Ally, still On Air."

----------------
Joking OF COURSE, Dubai....., but I'll guess lightyears away from AI making decisions in the football.

What do you think of that McCoist, to me he's a total waste of pixels on the telly.

Coisty is ok. He always looks at things from a more positive angle which i personally warm too.

Coisty or Sutton? ……. Super Ally every day of the week.

Edit to add: He was also very congratulatory towards Hibernian in 2016 after the cup win. Unlike all the other twisted faced media. I mean no doubt he had a few unsavoury words behind closed doors but that's across the board.

Funny that cause i look on him in the opposite way,
he seems to me to just back up what his sidekick says, and to say whatever sounds good to whoever he's talking to,
That Steve McManaman, is the worst, We turn the sound down if he's commentating,

you sort of hinted on my points with this quote,
Edit to add: He was also very congratulatory towards Hibernian in 2016 after the cup win. Unlike all the other twisted faced media. I mean no doubt he had a few unsavoury words behind closed doors but thats across the board.