Town’s chance of a top 6 finish this season….

[hallamblue]

Based on these states, whilst dooable, it looks like a top 6 finish would some achievement. I’m surprised by the figures below, just how low most newly promoted teams actually finish in their first promoted season back in the Championship, with a below mid table final position not uncommon.

FWIW, I’ve predicted Town to finish 5th!

WHERE NEWLY-PROMOTED CHAMPIONSHIP SIDES HAVE FINISHED

*Top-six finishes highlighted

22/23: Wigan 24th, Rotherham 19th, Sunderland 6th

21/22: Hull 19th, Peterborough 22nd, Blackpool 16th

20/21: Coventry 16th, Rotherham 23rd, Wycombe 22nd

19/20: Luton 19th, Barnsley 21st, Charlton 22nd

18/19: Wigan 18th, Blackburn 15th, Rotherham 22nd

17/18: Sheff U 10th, Bolton 21st, Millwall 8th

16/17: Wigan 23rd, Burton 20th, Barnsley 14th

15/16: Bristol C 18th, MK Dons 23rd, Preston 11th

14/15: Wolves 7th, Brentford 5th, Rotherham 21st

13/14: Doncaster 22nd, Bournemouth 19th, Yeovil 24th

12/13: Charlton 9th, Sheff W 18th, Huddersfield 19th

11/12: Brighton 10th, Southampton 2nd, Peterborough 18th

10/11: Norwich 2nd, Leeds 7th, Millwall 9th

09/10: Leicester 5th, Peterborough 24th, Scunthorpe 20th

08/09: Swansea 8th, Nottm Forest 19th, Doncaster 14th

07/08: Scunthorpe 23rd, Bristol City 4th, Blackpool 19th

06/07: Southend 22nd, Colchester 10th, Barnsley 20th

05/06: Luton 10th, Hull 18th, Sheff W 19th

04/05: Plymouth 17th, QPR 11th, Brighton 20th

03/04: Wigan 7th, Crewe 18th, Cardiff 13th

[Charnwood]

Mmmm’m. In the past 13 seasons only 2 teams have made the Play Offs (Sunderland & Brentford) with neither getting promoted.

It looks like you have to go back to 2011/12 (Southampton) and 2010/11 ( Norwich City) to find the last times when a League One Club had back to back promotions to the Premier League with both securing automatic promotion as Runners Up.

The simple answer is, anything Norwich can do we can do better. Town to be promoted as Champions.

[hallamblue]

Ha ha exactly Andy .
I did wonder if in those seasons 2010-2012 if the championship was actually not very strong because those two clubs going up in consecutive seasons is definitely a blip from the main trend isn’t it.

[Charnwood]

All joking aside Liz I think we’re only a couple of players short of being equipped enough for a Play Off challenge or even better. I think we need an Alan Hunter type no nonsense CB and a right sided attacking midfield player to link up with Harry Clarke in the same way Nathan Broadhead links up with Leif Davis on the left but still gets into goal scoring positions.

If we could achieve this and avoid any long term injury problem we could well be a surprise package and take one of the automatic places like Southampton and Norwich achieved. After 14 years it’s long overdue and I’d be more than happy for us to be runners up to Leicester City or any other team that wants to go one better.

I know it’s early days but I see no reason why we shouldn’t set our sights on a Top 6 place and I’m pretty sure that’s what Kieron McKenna and Gamechanger will be focussing their attention on.

I just hope you guys who don’t aspire to getting back to the Premier League because you don’t like it won’t be too disappointed and wishing we were back in the Championship.

[Ricco]

It's quite interesting the lack of certainty and satisfaction surrounding Burns, don't you think with a bit of time he and Clarke can be effective? He's been top 'assister' in both seasons he's been at the club. First season 7 assists and 13 goals (second being Celina with 6 assists, 6 goals), second season 16 assists and 9 goals (second being Davis with 14 assists, 4 goals). So his final ball quality is as good as any, perhaps his all round game just isn't up to scratch in many people's eyes?

[Mauswara]

It's become less common for a promoted team to reach the top end of the table on the first attempt, Sunderland are the first for many years and it surprised most people including Sunderland. Thank the parachute payments.

[Ricco]

It'll be interesting to see how many of those teams smashed up League 1 as much as Town did after the Jan transfers! I still think the club struggled because of heavier winter pitches last year, I hope they have a plan to tackle that this year and we don't see a dip in results.

[Bluemike]

It's quite interesting the lack of certainty and satisfaction surrounding Burns, don't you think with a bit of time he and Clarke can be effective? He's been top 'assister' in both seasons he's been at the club. First season 7 assists and 13 goals (second being Celina with 6 assists, 6 goals), second season 16 assists and 9 goals (second being Davis with 14 assists, 4 goals). So his final ball quality is as good as any, perhaps his all round game just isn't up to scratch in many people's eyes?

Burns is a odd one for sure, his first season was exceptional when he won all the awards and accolades and rightly so, he set the bar high and when his efforts dropped a tiny bit last season it was highlighted excessively in my opinion, I think having no real summer break didn't help.

This season he's definitely had a couple of up and down games but he was up against a very good player at Sunderland and again on Saturday so maybe he's had a tough start for valid reasons.

I do think we definitely need another wide player to challenge for the starting Eleven but I don't necessarily see it as a,replacement for Wes Burns. I also think the cameo contributions of Kayden Jackson are going under the radar, for me he has been excellent when coming on, sometimes in a role that rarely gets recognition.

[Charnwood]

It's quite interesting the lack of certainty and satisfaction surrounding Burns, don't you think with a bit of time he and Clarke can be effective? He's been top 'assister' in both seasons he's been at the club. First season 7 assists and 13 goals (second being Celina with 6 assists, 6 goals), second season 16 assists and 9 goals (second being Davis with 14 assists, 4 goals). So his final ball quality is as good as any, perhaps his all round game just isn't up to scratch in many people's eyes?

I was quite happy with Burns in League One he just seems to be struggling with the faster pace in the Championship which results in him either being caught in possession or frantically passing the ball straight to an opponent more often than his team mates. I accept its early days and he may well still make the adjustment but if he doesn’t and we don’t have an able replacement the team could become lop sided to the left which makes it easier for our opponents to defend.

[number 9]

I just hope you guys who don’t aspire to getting back to the Premier League because you don’t like it won’t be too disappointed and wishing we were back in the Championship.

[Bluemike]

It's not really about us being in the Premier League or not, naturally we all want to gain promotion but it's what follows that I'm not keen on for reasons already stated. Clearly we are a long way off that problem anyhow but should it happen it's a whole new world, the owners will love it and rightly so, they deserve it, but for the average fan there are as many negatives as positives, Purley my take on it of course and the daft thing is I'll be willing us on every week to do it. The bottom line is that I just don't like the Premier League and everything it stands for.

[Blue Wilf]

It's not really about us being in the Premier League or not, naturally we all want to gain promotion but it's what follows that I'm not keen on for reasons already stated. Clearly we are a long way off that problem anyhow but should it happen it's a whole new world, the owners will love it and rightly so, they deserve it, but for the average fan there are as many negatives as positives, Purley my take on it of course and the daft thing is I'll be willing us on every week to do it. The bottom line is that I just don't like the Premier League and everything it stands for.

Exactly my take on it too. I WANT us to get there but fear that when we get there it will be less enjoyable for fans as we then become one of the perceived 'big' clubs and get the usual names linked, a whole list of overpriced and overpaid primadonnas and an army of 'fans' who have never tasted what it is really like to be a Town fan clamouring to get on the bandwagon. I hope I am wrong and would love the chance of a season or two just to see - its just a fear I have. What has been evident for mw this weekend is how many prem players appear disinterested and don't want that to be us!

[Ricco]

Yeah good points about Burns, he always seems to have a fairly laid back attitude, which is not always a bad thing, but a good player to push him would be good.

And about the Prem, it's always been about the journey not the destination in my opinion. The most important thing is to do things the right way, play good attacking and entertaining football, try and win the league you're in, try and work hard, try new things, try to evolve, strive to improve, fight for 3pts, don't settle for 1. etc etc etc. Basically I'm just enjoying the attitude about the place, it's the perfect antidote and antithesis from McCarthy's boring, "well the 11 men behind the ball draws keep us in the league" approach, even though it's an entertainment industry and the supporters would rather have their eyes pecked out by rabid budgies than watch that pure dirge. Oh how wrong did he get football management, I hope he sees McKenna's approach and it makes him physically sick with embarrassment. At least he has done well with his jobs after he left Town, because he was always smarter than everyone else.

Side-tracked there for a moment...

The prem is 100% not the be all and end all, but you wouldn't chose to finish 3rd over 2nd so you don't go up. You have a go, maybe you do a Leicester, maybe you do a Derby, it's all part of it. You don't know how the prem will change over a few short years, so get up there and take the money if you can, it can bring improved facilities and security if nothing else.

[Bluemike]

Absolutely you take it if you can but it's rather like the guy who finds his way to the best brothel on earth only to end up with syphilis.

[number 9]

If we are promoted to the Prem in the not too distant future, I hope we'll be able to at least compete at the top half of the table. Of course my dream is to see us playing in Europe again, preferably the CL.

Back on topic, we obviously have a lot of work to do in the Championship first. I have no doubt we'll be in the mix even though the odds are stacked against us. Let's not forget the 2000/2001 5th placed finish in the Prem after being promoted. I think it's fair to say, we're strong enough to accomplish similar accolades this season.

[Ricco]

Absolutely you take it if you can but it's rather like the guy who finds his way to the best brothel on earth only to end up with syphilis.

Beautifully and poetically put Mike

[Andym]

The stats that started this thread are very interesting and very informative. I suspect many of us believe there is a big gulf between the prem and the championship; these stats suggest there is also a pretty big gap between league 1 and the championship.

I imagine we are better placed than many of those who struggled to cope with the step up as there would appear to be a strong correlation between league position in that first season and the financial resources available, i.e. those who did well probably had a significant financial backing and/or fan base.

Although it would be great to achieve promotion again, I'm not sure Id prefer it to regular high finishes in the Championship - unless we can become at least a mid-table prem team. I wouldn't really want to watch having to scrap for every point, struggling to avoid relegation, playing on Friday night/Saturday lunchtime/Saturday evening/Sunday/Monday evening just to keep the Sky TV programmers happy. In the words of the Kinks, I like my football on a Saturday.

Anyway, back to the topic, I am hoping for a mid-table finish. Top half would be good, top 6 would be excellent.

[Bluemike]

Spot on Andy, although my hopes are a top 6 finish

[hallamblue]

Premiership is fine if you are a professional footballer, football club owner or investor. If you’re a fan of a PL it’s all pay, pay, pay… at extortionate levels. I’d like Town to get promotion to the PL and stay up for a couple of seasons if possible, primarily to allow Gamechanger to recoup their investment. Other than that, the PL sucks!

[Cabanas Blue]

Absolutely you take it if you can but it's rather like the guy who finds his way to the best brothel on earth only to end up with syphilis.

It seems you know me to well Mike.

[Charnwood]

I guess I’m in the minority because I luv watching Premier League football and watch two of three full matches every week. Furthermore I’d love to see Town promoted there with Kieron McKenna at the helm as I think with Gamechanger we’d have the necessary financial backing to be there to stay. In my opinion the Premier League is the best football league in the world and to be part of it would be achieving the ultimate goal in League Football worldwide.

I think the game has changed too over recent years and there’s room for smart operators like Brighton & Hove and Brentford etc who have developed new ways to compete with the big boys by developing super smart recruitment programmes. Fulham is another club that looks to have its feet under the table in the Premier League without a large stadium and big crowds.

I’m so excited to have broken free from League One and with our current owners I don’t think it will be too long before we find ourselves back in the Premiership, something that not along ago I thought was unachievable in my lifetime but now I’m not so sure. Maybe it won’t happen but I can’t say that with the same certainty I could have just a couple of seasons ago when getting out of League One looked almost impossible.

[Bluemike]

You make a good point about Brighton Andy, I guess that's what we should aspire to, who knows, we certainly have the owners and Manager to do it.

[Charnwood]

You make a good point about Brighton Andy, I guess that's what we should aspire to, who knows, we certainly have the owners and Manager to do it.

….. and in the last year or so they’ve bagged €338m from the sale of 8 players and it hasn’t affected their ability to perform by a jot making €268m profit along tbe way.

CAICEDO - Chelsea - €127M. (4.5m)
CUCURELLA - Chelsea - €65.3M. (15m)
MAC ALLISTER - Liverpool - €42.0m. (Loan)
BISSOUMA - Tottenham - €29.2m (16m)
TROSSARD - Arsenal - €24.0м. (15m)
SÁNCHEZ - Chelsea - €23.0м. (0m)
BURN - Newcastle - €15.0m. (3m)
MAUPAY - Everton - €11.8м. (15m)

In addition to these high value sales there have been some smaller value sales worth another €13m taking their transfer profit to €270m since Jan 2022.

[Bluemike]

Those figures are staggering

[Charnwood]

Those figures are staggering

….. and there’s no reason why we couldn’t do the same starting with Brandon Williams from Manchester United who with McKenna’s coaching could be another Marc Cucerella.

If only hey.