Ipswich Town v Rotherham United preview and matchday thread

[patthegimp]

Do you honestly think that Mick would give two fs about players concerns. Especially if they didnt agree with his tactical nous. I dont think so. If soft cuddly Roy couldnt get his point across what hope would there be for any one else?

[Mr.Punch]

can't be bothered to say too much.
Thought McGoldrick and Williams looked quality.
Chambers apparently played them onside for their first goal.
Rotherham really wasted time all second half, so no sympathy from me when they blew it at the end.
Really annoyed with Skuse for giving them the ball back after they kicked it out following an 'injury' to their player - just a nonsense and showed that we didn't want it enough.
Despite some good creative play at times, it was just another frustrating afternoon - nothing in the final third, nobody driving them on. And despite a last-minute equaliser boos aplenty just 20 seconds later.

At least we can thank Brighton for giving us something to cheer about.

[arana peligrosa]

There was a sense as the game entered it's closing stages where you'd almost hope the opposition had kept their lead and we'd seen defeat, in the expectation it may just have been enough to see McCarthy out of the club once and for all.

Even then would the owner really have taken any action ? (Evans) just seems content to observe sporadically from a distance and remain largely oblivious to what occurs each match day.

Took in post-game reaction and game write-up and while there are the few that remain - that offer the manager a level of defense,- from a personal viewpoint I lost patience with the individual some time before today's game. People invariably bring up the play-off achievement and stability issue, but it's wearing thin now when you take into consideration the amount of garbage that followed it.

In an ideal world, someone somewhere will realize McCarthy can do no more at this club and make the necessary arrangements, but the reality is we're in all probability going to be with the chump for the rest of the season.

A season in which, is basically over even at this premature stage of the campaign.

[derick_ipsw]

Caption: Pass me another ball...that one was delicious!!

[Andym]

This wasn't our worst performance of the season, but still not great, and highlighted some of our problems.

Some reports claim we played well in the first half. I thought we had moments of good football, but I wouldn't call it great. Once we went 2-1 down,
we knew that Rotherham would get 10 men behind the ball. And we lacked any inspiration and, worse still, any real desire to do anything about it.

We look at games and try to analyse our tactics. I often find it hard to see what system we are playing. That's not a criticism of our tactics, more of a criticism of my own failing powers of observation. However, there were some obvious deficiencies:

1. Full backs. Neither showed any great desire to get forward. Kenlock was a disappointment to me. Defensively reasonable, hardly got forward at all (particularly second half), and showed himself to be a perfect replacement for Knudsen as neither of them can pass wind, let alone a football. Gave the ball away repeatedly in the second half.

2. Width. Did we have any? Most of it seemed to come from Sears who will run the channels but has no support. See 3.

3. Pace. What pace? We have none apart from Sears. he would get the ball out wide, hold it up, no one gets near. We must be the slowest team in England.

4. Movement / desire. This is the most worrying aspect. At one point in the second half I screamed at Skuse to "shift your arse and move into the gap you lazy b*stard!" But he's not alone. The defence appeared static for both goals. When Sears got the ball wide, he would try to win a corner and, when successful, others would wander up into the box. But no one busts a gut to get up in support. No one ever moves into space. Even Bishop, who is usually pretty quick and mobile, was I guess under instructions to stay back.

5. McGoldrick. Great touches, great goal. Slow moving and some poor passes. But it's bloody hard to pass when no one moves away from their marker or into space.

So we couldn't break them down due to a lack of width / fullbacks getting forward, lack of movement, and lack of pace.

My man of the match would be Sears. he ran, he found space, took his goal well....and had no support whatsoever.

[charlton837]

Andy I agree with pretty much all you have said apart from Kenlock. I thought he did make an effort to get forward, particularly in the first half. He did knock the ball out a few times just as many others did, but I could always see him hugging the touchline and had his hand in the air asking for the ball, I thought he got forward much better than Knudsen and with a run of games I think he would be a more effective full back than Knudsen. I saw him play quite a few times in the U18's and in that team he loved to get forwards, he was very much an attack minded wing back so he has some attributes we could do with, whether or not he would be given that freedom in the first team under MM is another matter.

On the match itself I actually felt we played OK but gave away 2 very poor goals. First half I thought we knocked it about in patches, but also had patches of looking dreadful. To me that is the story of our team, I believe the players have it in them to play, but they are in no way consistent and seem to lack any sort of confidence. If we are honest if you live off freebies and younger "potential" then you end up with very hit and miss players, that's why they are at Ipswich and not playing at a higher level. Players like Grant Ward for example, he has been fairly useless for the large part but had a couple of very good games, against Norwich he was fantastic, for me the most frustrating thing about him was that against Rotherham he wasn't even putting a shift in and was largely ineffective. Sears had a good game, amazing what happens when you actually play a striker up front, he was much more central for the most part although did drift a bit too wide at times, Didzy was looking for him down the middle but ill cut him some slack as he has been playing wide for so long now it probably comes natural to drift out there.

The defence looked a bit shaky which was not usual, a couple of times the ball bounced in the box and neither defence or Bart took control, it just causes unnecessary panic amongst the team. The midfield were frustrating me, Skuse is better than he thinks he is, I know he plays a defensive role but I feel he has more in him and can offer more than he currently is. Bishop was OK in patches, but is probably still getting up to the pace of the game but he needs to stick with him in the team, on his day he could be our best player. It was interesting he dropped Douglas completely, I was happy with that as I don't rate him whatsoever but I know there is mixed opinions on him.

In truth the atmosphere would have been even worse had we of lost, and the pressure on MM would have been huge. The goal only at the end only really partially saved us some embarrassment but the fans have turned, and in my experience this only ever ends one way, I might not be now but at some point MM will leave. Once you lose the fans this way its almost impossible to get them back. Even if we had a good run, the moment things aren't going well you will have these fans back in force. I am in the camp of wanting MM to go, however I see bigger issues, I want us to go back to basics. I want a proper accountable board in place, not just a faceless owner with a business mouthpiece (Milne). I am fed up of Evans and his cronies. I thank him for saving us at a difficult time, and MM will always have my respect for what he did for this club too, I know he is not the most liked man in the world right now in Ipswich but he did a job and he did very well with extremely limited resources. He has in my opinion taken us as far as he can and its all gone stale. He looks to me to be a manager who right now doesn't know what his best team is and is trying so many different things with the team, none of which is clicking. He will never say it but I think deep down he is questioning himself and doesn't know what the solution is. For the goals against Rotherham, the players themselves should take more responsibility, they were poor goals and didn't come from the way we were set up. Just like many others I am bored stiff of whats being served up, I just wanted to give a balanced view, yes the football under MM at the moment is s**t and something needs to change, but lets also not forget he has done a good job up for the majority of the 4 years he has been here.

I think we need a younger style manager in place, and you know what that could mean things get worse before they get better. But we need some modern fresh ideas and most importantly need to settle on a proper club philosophy, a style of how we want to play and buy to players to fit in with this rather than just taking whats about and trying to make a team of them. Look at the Bournemouth/Swansea model, they only take on managers/players that fit their style, Swansea did it with Martinez at the start and continued in that vein, im not saying we need to play such fluid football (although it would be nice), we just need a vision that the club, fans, players, owners buy in to. I personally would like to see more from our academy, they cant do any worse then some of the "pros" at the moment, they will never learn unless they are allowed to play and make some mistakes after all.

[number 9]

Very wise words, charlton.

[Andym]

I agree with a lot of what you say, Charlton. I just wonder whether Kenlock and Bishop were instructed to stay back. I know he is returning from injury but Bishop has the energy and pace to play box to box. But he didn't in Saturday. he played very deep. We are playing the bottom team in the league and MM doesn't trust Skuse as a lone defensive midfielder?

[herforder]

Our priority in January should be to bring in an exoerienced central midfielder able to dominate, dictate possession, launch attacks by forward thinking passing and generally be the lynchpin that we so glaringly lack. Think of Shelvy's performance for Newcastle, or the role that Magilton played for us in the past. One that's never adequately been replaced.

Can understand why others may believe that it's another striker required, which may be true - though not if it means reverting to hoofball. But, for me, as borne out by our second half performance on Saturday, and many others in the past, unless and until we can find - and be prepared to pay- for an effective midfield leader/playmaker, then any other initiatives will be hamstrung.

[charlton837]

Yes Andy completely agree about Bishop, he certainly can be box to box and if anything he should be much more attacking. He did it in patches, but ive noticed lately hes been more focused on tracking back and putting the tackles in. I have no problem with him wanting to tackle of course, but he needs to be the one to unlock defences and look for that killer ball. He has great technical ability, we need to use it. Seems to me when MM first brought him into the team he did allow him this freedom, same with Williams which is why the fans loved him so much. But these days it does seem that we restrict all our "sexy" players as MM calls them.

I had never really thought about the Skuse thing, but yes clearly he doesn't trust him, he always plays another in there with him to make interceptions and to track back too much, whether than be Douglas, Bishop or anyone else. In the season we finished in the playoffs im sure we only really had Skuse protecting the back 4? We were never silky but we did at least try and beat the opposition, albeit at times it was through out battling them rather than playing them off the park.

Hertforder - I understand what you are saying too, my belief is we already have those playmaker midfielders in Bishop and Williams. If we bring any more in we will just be flooded with them. The main issue is playing in a style that suits these players, in the certain formation and style of play any playmakers we have are stifled as they are being asked to do a more defensive role, but also when they do have the ball nobody is in front of them making the movement, we are too focused on keeping our shape to stop the opposition all the time. I was actually happy with the lineup on Saturday, but it became clear the main issue was the tactics, that team of 11 should have beaten Rotherham, the game was there for the taking, we just needed to be a little more brave and play our way through them, we had most of our technical players out there. We don't need a target man for these games, we have enough ability to outfootball some of these teams, but it seems to me MM doesn't believe that to be the case.

Im concerned we are becoming West Brom of the Championship. By that I mean they just gave Pulis another contract and have really annoyed their fans. Their fans have been calling for him to go as the style of football is awful and also the owner isn't investing as he perhaps should be. I hear Dean Kiely on Talksport the other day say that in the case of West Brom its worth them losing 4 or 5,000 season ticket holders in order to play poor football and stay in the premier league where the money is. This comment outraged me and made me realize the state of affairs football is in. Its the same at PR, ME will be making his money somehow and he doesn't seem bothered with what the fans are really saying. Too much money has come in the game, and so fans are no longer valued, I would much prefer the gate receipts to be a significant chunk of the income of clubs, that way we would be valued much more. Or a rule to say that every club must have fans representation on the board in some capacity but this will never happen...

[herforder]

Understand completely your point about over cautious, risk-averse, tactics - something Mick Mills was trying to explain in post-match exchanges. But I continue to believe that MM - an instinctively defensive-minded individual - chooses to set-up and coach as he does partly because there's no midfield 'general' available of sufficient experience or quality. Acknowledge that both Bishop and Williams are technically good offensive midfielders, with future potential to fill that key role. However, both are still finding their way, and need significantly more games - and injury free runs - in order to gain the experience, authority and confidence needed to fill that role. And, of course, JW is a loanee.

I think, though, that with Bishop, McG and Williams returning to full fitness and sharpness, MM will increasingly find the confidence to move towards a more positive tactical mindset, and arrive at a template based on winning, as opposed to not losing, games. I'm prepared to give him a bit of time to show that he's capable of doing so. I know, however, that many have abandoned any hope of that!

[Bluemike]

Understand completely your point about over cautious, risk-averse, tactics - something Mick Mills was trying to explain in post-match exchanges. But I continue to believe that MM - an instinctively defensive-minded individual - chooses to set-up and coach as he does partly because there's no midfield 'general' available of sufficient experience or quality. Acknowledge that both Bishop and Williams are technically good offensive midfielders, with future potential to fill that key role. However, both are still finding their way, and need significantly more games - and injury free runs - in order to gain the experience, authority and confidence needed to fill that role. And, of course, JW is a loanee.

I think, though, that with Bishop, McG and Williams returning to full fitness and sharpness, MM will increasingly find the confidence to move towards a more positive tactical mindset, and arrive at a template based on winning, as opposed to not losing, games. I'm prepared to give him a bit of time to show that he's capable of doing so. I know, however, that many have abandoned any hope of that!

Like you I too am more than prepared to give MM time to show this is just a horrendous blip, with all the players getting back to fitness this can surely only help us. That said I am getting fed up of some of the tripe on offer in recent games, I was quite happy up until the Leeds sham but since then it is steadily becoming a borefest, for that MM has to take the blame.

As I said after the Rotherham game the players need to be accountable too, how any manager in the world could stop the laughable defending for Rotherhams Two goals I really don't know.

[hallamblue]

Question.

is Mick doing the coaching or Terry?

Mick was a centre half = defensively minded
Terry was a centre forward = attack minded

[Bluemike]

Question.

is Mick doing the coaching or Terry?

Mick was a centre half = defensively minded
Terry was a centre forward = attack minded

I believe TC takes the strikers, that has been mentioned loads of times, one would assume MM does the overall training though.

[hallamblue]

Question.

is Mick doing the coaching or Terry?

Mick was a centre half = defensively minded
Terry was a centre forward = attack minded

I believe TC takes the strikers, that has been mentioned loads of times, one would assume MM does the overall training though.

Oh well, that explains everything then lol !

[herforder]

All that's needed now is for somebody to train the trainers!

[hallamblue]

All that's needed now is for somebody to train the trainers!

lol, I reckon even I could do that

[herforder]

All that's needed now is for somebody to train the trainers!

lol, I reckon even I could do that

Awesome idea - start with their ball skills!

[Bluemike]

All that's needed now is for somebody to train the trainers!

lol, I reckon even I could do that

Awesome idea - start with their ball skills!

That's her specialist subject.

[hallamblue]

awh no it isn't.....I have other skills ya know !

[marko69]

awh no it isn't.....I have other skills ya know !

Not correcting auto-correct?