Well said Ollie
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- Bluemike
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Re: Well said Ollie
611-4-ITFC & Jack, I have said exactly the same thing on more than one occasion recently, once the fans are this anti the boss that is a done job and he will get the sack sooner rather than later, you never turn this situation around and with more and more fans jumping ship after every defeat it is inevitable that Mick will go at some point in the fairly near future, whether he turns it around or not.
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Re: Well said Ollie
611-4-ITFC I agree with most of what you say but not about us as a squad overachieving (unless your not referring to this season?). I would say this season we are distinctly underachieving, we do not have a squad of world beaters, but at the beginning of the year the general consensus is we have a stronger squad with more talent, MM himself said this. So I would say not having 2 wins in a row 19 games in to the season, being the lowest scorers in the Championship and the lowest away scorers in the football league (I think?) is in my opinion unacceptable.
Do I blame MM for this? No not fully, but he has to take responsibility for some of it. We had a plan to bleed in youngsters, this is not really happening, OK some of them may be in the first team squad, but MM does not have the courage to play them. Knudsen has had a very poor spell, why not play Kenlock and blood him in? Let him make a couple of mistakes and learn from them, Knudsen is making plenty anyway. We have Chambers at RB, this has gone on far too long, we have a RB on the books, he needs time to play and learn his trade, he wont do that on the bench and he will fizzle out to nothing. Evans has a lot to answer for, we have to acknowledge and appreciate what he did for us when he took the club on, and the financial and time support he gave managers, but these days he seems to show no evidence of caring or any connection with fans of this club. He is invisible and at a time like this that is not good enough.
Do I blame MM for this? No not fully, but he has to take responsibility for some of it. We had a plan to bleed in youngsters, this is not really happening, OK some of them may be in the first team squad, but MM does not have the courage to play them. Knudsen has had a very poor spell, why not play Kenlock and blood him in? Let him make a couple of mistakes and learn from them, Knudsen is making plenty anyway. We have Chambers at RB, this has gone on far too long, we have a RB on the books, he needs time to play and learn his trade, he wont do that on the bench and he will fizzle out to nothing. Evans has a lot to answer for, we have to acknowledge and appreciate what he did for us when he took the club on, and the financial and time support he gave managers, but these days he seems to show no evidence of caring or any connection with fans of this club. He is invisible and at a time like this that is not good enough.
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Re: Well said Ollie
I agree with a lot of this, especially MM's responsibility about team selection and not having the courage to blood youngsters. Its just so short-sighted - yes, short-term, players like Douglas will know what to do and follow team instructions and go through the minimum MM requirements, but there will never be any real team advancement. He should have stuck to his guns and brought in Williams for Bishop - but the first opportunity, back comes Douglas. And then a gloating preaching session from MM about why Dougie needs to be in the side. If he's always thought that - then why drop Douglas in the first place? Feels like he's trying to teach us a lesson.charlton837 wrote:611-4-ITFC I agree with most of what you say but not about us as a squad overachieving (unless your not referring to this season?). I would say this season we are distinctly underachieving, we do not have a squad of world beaters, but at the beginning of the year the general consensus is we have a stronger squad with more talent, MM himself said this. So I would say not having 2 wins in a row 19 games in to the season, being the lowest scorers in the Championship and the lowest away scorers in the football league (I think?) is in my opinion unacceptable.
Do I blame MM for this? No not fully, but he has to take responsibility for some of it. We had a plan to bleed in youngsters, this is not really happening, OK some of them may be in the first team squad, but MM does not have the courage to play them. Knudsen has had a very poor spell, why not play Kenlock and blood him in? Let him make a couple of mistakes and learn from them, Knudsen is making plenty anyway. We have Chambers at RB, this has gone on far too long, we have a RB on the books, he needs time to play and learn his trade, he wont do that on the bench and he will fizzle out to nothing. Evans has a lot to answer for, we have to acknowledge and appreciate what he did for us when he took the club on, and the financial and time support he gave managers, but these days he seems to show no evidence of caring or any connection with fans of this club. He is invisible and at a time like this that is not good enough.
Any time Kenlock and Emanuell are giving opportunities, they are immediately dropped. They will never learn without exposure .... and sitting on the bench ...will they learn anything watching Chambers and Knudsen perform... that should send them even further backwards!!!
I've had enough of the side-show of The Undroppables. Pick them, Mick. You want to - so pick them and see how we get on and we'll see more and more glowing "different class" praises amid a bunch of mediocre displays and weak excuses. If there's a real agenda to change the style and blood youngsters (not half-hearted and over 3 games) - fans are more likely to be patient. Going back to type after a few games achieves nothing.
MM's hands are most likely financially-tied by ME (the biggest problem), but he's setting the bar far too low and it feels like enough huff and puff is enough. MM not all to blame, but is just a bit too comfortable taking up ME's slack and giving it back to fans who have no idea of what direction we are going in.
- herforder
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Re: Well said Ollie
The Stuart Watson piece in yesterday's local press pulls all these threads together cogently and accurately. However, whilst it's relatively easy to gnaw away at the key issues - as judged by the Press and supporters - getting action to address them is another matter. Particularly if those with the power are standing with hands on ears singing la, la, la, la! When their noise echoes around a half empty stadium, perhaps the message might hit home. But don't hold your breath!
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Re: Well said Ollie
Maybe over-achieving in terms of this season would be an incorrect reflection. I think where I was trying to position myself was that MM is getting as much mileage out of the quality of his players as could be possible during his tenure.
Mick makes what, for us, seem like mistakes I.e playing players out of position, but I think to some extent that he, in Emmanuel's case particularly, has not always got a 30+ game a season replacement. Young players are ALWAYS the lifeblood of many clubs, and while they can play a big part, it would be too easy to burn them out and ruin a promising career.
On the topic of ME, as, I think Hallam said, January will tell us a lot about ME's intentions/ level of interest. There is always rumour of a Murphy replacement, but will we sign this type player? Or do we end up with a loan player? Personally, if money is available I want to see MM here to spend it, however the likely reality with several games to play before the transfer window, is that a new manager could well be in place. From a business point of view it makes sense. Can you imagine the season ticket sales (as well as merchandise) if the club stays on its current level. Maybe we read ME wrong, as I am sure it is not good for his company to have it's name associated with a sub-standard product! A team playing well gets more television presence, that shirt logo gets seen more too.
Mick makes what, for us, seem like mistakes I.e playing players out of position, but I think to some extent that he, in Emmanuel's case particularly, has not always got a 30+ game a season replacement. Young players are ALWAYS the lifeblood of many clubs, and while they can play a big part, it would be too easy to burn them out and ruin a promising career.
On the topic of ME, as, I think Hallam said, January will tell us a lot about ME's intentions/ level of interest. There is always rumour of a Murphy replacement, but will we sign this type player? Or do we end up with a loan player? Personally, if money is available I want to see MM here to spend it, however the likely reality with several games to play before the transfer window, is that a new manager could well be in place. From a business point of view it makes sense. Can you imagine the season ticket sales (as well as merchandise) if the club stays on its current level. Maybe we read ME wrong, as I am sure it is not good for his company to have it's name associated with a sub-standard product! A team playing well gets more television presence, that shirt logo gets seen more too.
- herforder
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Re: Well said Ollie
The perverse thing is that we probably have a stronger, higher quality, squad which performances and results do not reflect. Notwithstanding MM's instinctive risk averse mentality, it's invariably fine margins that determine the outcome of matches; or individual mistakes that can't be legislated for. In the final analysis, however, whilst ME remains the owner, MM will remain the manager. I could envisage that remaining the case even if we were - heaven forbid - relegated.
That said, in the circles that ME operates he would not wish to be seen as the man who effectively ploughed a much loved and respected club into the mire. He will certainly have one eye upon how history will ultimately judge him. But I have real doubts as to whether he actually has the available financial resources - presumably generated from elsewhere within his business empire - to fund much beyond existing investment levels.
That said, in the circles that ME operates he would not wish to be seen as the man who effectively ploughed a much loved and respected club into the mire. He will certainly have one eye upon how history will ultimately judge him. But I have real doubts as to whether he actually has the available financial resources - presumably generated from elsewhere within his business empire - to fund much beyond existing investment levels.
- The Odious Mr Rossi
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Re: Well said Ollie
Then I suggest you google both his personal wealth and the financial accounts of Marcus Evans Group for last year to satisfy yourself that he has indeed got access to substantial financial resource. Trust me - he most definitely has.herforder wrote:The perverse thing is that we probably have a stronger, higher quality, squad which performances and results do not reflect. Notwithstanding MM's instinctive risk averse mentality, it's invariably fine margins that determine the outcome of matches; or individual mistakes that can't be legislated for. In the final analysis, however, whilst ME remains the owner, MM will remain the manager. I could envisage that remaining the case even if we were - heaven forbid - relegated.
That said, in the circles that ME operates he would not wish to be seen as the man who effectively ploughed a much loved and respected club into the mire. He will certainly have one eye upon how history will ultimately judge him. But I have real doubts as to whether he actually has the available financial resources - presumably generated from elsewhere within his business empire - to fund much beyond existing investment levels.
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Re: Well said Ollie
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth ... net-worth/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/?curid=14001406
I tried to Google the Marcus Evans group accounts but this appears to be a minefield........ can't find anything!
But his personal wealth has him just shy of a couple Mil short of being a billionaire!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/?curid=14001406
I tried to Google the Marcus Evans group accounts but this appears to be a minefield........ can't find anything!
But his personal wealth has him just shy of a couple Mil short of being a billionaire!
- herforder
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Re: Well said Ollie
$ billionaire! Which matches his Sunday Times rich list wealth at around £480 million - depending on strength of the UK £! Still a lot of loot. However, it's one thing having it 'on paper', or tied up in property, investments or get out of gaol free cards, but actually producing hard cash - the currency of football - might not be that straightforward.
"So, Mr Evans, you want to buy Bert Van Hoof to replace Daryl Murphy, then send us a cheque - although cash preferred - for £1.5m, and he's all yours". "Oh, and I expect Bert's agent, Robin Barsteward, will also need feeding - so let's call it an uncomplicated £2M. And no, we don't take Robbie Williams concert tickets in part payment"
"So, Mr Evans, you want to buy Bert Van Hoof to replace Daryl Murphy, then send us a cheque - although cash preferred - for £1.5m, and he's all yours". "Oh, and I expect Bert's agent, Robin Barsteward, will also need feeding - so let's call it an uncomplicated £2M. And no, we don't take Robbie Williams concert tickets in part payment"

- Bluemike
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Re: Well said Ollie
I still fail to see what his personal wealth has to do with what he invests in ITFC.
- marko69
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Re: Well said Ollie
I googled Mevans......., got something about his best mate in Brazil.hallamblue wrote:http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth ... net-worth/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/?curid=14001406
I tried to Google the Marcus Evans group accounts but this appears to be a minefield........ can't find anything!
But his personal wealth has him just shy of a couple Mil short of being a billionaire!

- Bluemike
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Re: Well said Ollie
LOL Marko, that's not a bad likeness.
As I thought nothing has come of this Brazil nonsense then.
As I thought nothing has come of this Brazil nonsense then.
- marko69
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Re: Well said Ollie
Rotherham 1 QPR 0
Come on now, Ollie........, pull the finger out........ You'll be hung, drawn and quartered down Shepherds Bush way! You'll have this guy at your door.........
https://youtu.be/tTFOncppkJg
Come on now, Ollie........, pull the finger out........ You'll be hung, drawn and quartered down Shepherds Bush way! You'll have this guy at your door.........
https://youtu.be/tTFOncppkJg
- Mach_Polish_Blue
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Re: Well said Ollie
Took me a time to reply to this bullshit.
Ian Holloway once said (when Keane was our manager) that he'd die for Roy Keane but I can't remember him having been applauded for that. He somehow is after his comments re Mick.
Some outspoken useless manager whose team have lost today to by far the worst league team (Rotherham) tells me what I should feel. People like him, people from outside preach to us we should be careful what we wish for. Mr.Holloway just p**s off and get focused on your own job. Who does he think he is? Footballing guru?
Whether he's right or wrong he isn't the person to tell us that we should feel and think.
So our wonderful leader in Mick doesn't give Williams a starting place (even though he's fully fit and possess attacking threat), the team doesn't improve at all nor do they score goals but I should stay quiet and not voice my displeasure according to Holloway.
Ian Holloway once said (when Keane was our manager) that he'd die for Roy Keane but I can't remember him having been applauded for that. He somehow is after his comments re Mick.
Some outspoken useless manager whose team have lost today to by far the worst league team (Rotherham) tells me what I should feel. People like him, people from outside preach to us we should be careful what we wish for. Mr.Holloway just p**s off and get focused on your own job. Who does he think he is? Footballing guru?
Whether he's right or wrong he isn't the person to tell us that we should feel and think.
So our wonderful leader in Mick doesn't give Williams a starting place (even though he's fully fit and possess attacking threat), the team doesn't improve at all nor do they score goals but I should stay quiet and not voice my displeasure according to Holloway.
