Wigan Athletic v Ipswich Town preview and matchday thread

[Tangfastic]

Many thanks , gents, for the great reports.

Not an anti-Chambers rant, but I ask the question.... would it be better for Chambers himself if he's dropped?

Being played out of position, week in, week out and having his manager tell the fans he's undroppable.... I can't see this doing the player himself any good? My thoughts are also with young players like Emanuell (and Kenlock ) . What must they be thinking watching from the subs bench, knowing they could perform probably better but have no real chance of getting a game bar injury to Chambers/ Knudsen.
Every player has a bad game, but does Chambers ever give a MOTM performance or is considered as one of the top 4-5 players in the team?

Changing sport to Rugby Union, Chris Robshaw had the England captaincy taken away from him and he responded by improving his game and justifying his team selection.

I kind of think it could be a bit of good man-management by Mick to look at this. There are other senior players ... Skuse, Berra who should be candidates.... or even give the captaincy to our best players .... Bart or Webster. Does it matter.... do we have good leadership on the pitch already?

Chambers does not need to be in the team, he could be Club Captain like Bam Bam was and not neccasarily have to be team captain. Fist pumps can be achieved from the bench, too.

Getting distracted from the result and it's not all about Chambo. But does Chambers need to be put out of his misery so he can concentrate on improving his football. Being a proper bloke only goes so far.

Good result.... strange performance, but at least a result like this might mean we can go into the next game with a bit of positivity. Glad to see the strikers on the score-sheet, too.

[Bluemike]

I think it may indeed be a good thing for Chambo to at least have a break for a week or two, it just won't happen. I actually believe him to be a great captain but he is finding it tough at times and always seems to be up against the oppositions best player, yesterday Wildschut was hot and would have caused any RB problems, for what it is worth I actually think Knudsen is a bigger liability.

[The Odious Mr Rossi]

Many thanks , gents, for the great reports.

Not an anti-Chambers rant, but I ask the question.... would it be better for Chambers himself if he's dropped?

Being played out of position, week in, week out and having his manager tell the fans he's undroppable.... I can't see this doing the player himself any good? My thoughts are also with young players like Emanuell (and Kenlock ) . What must they be thinking watching from the subs bench, knowing they could perform probably better but have no real chance of getting a game bar injury to Chambers/ Knudsen.
Every player has a bad game, but does Chambers ever give a MOTM performance or is considered as one of the top 4-5 players in the team?

Changing sport to Rugby Union, Chris Robshaw had the England captaincy taken away from him and he responded by improving his game and justifying his team selection.

I kind of think it could be a bit of good man-management by Mick to look at this. There are other senior players ... Skuse, Berra who should be candidates.... or even give the captaincy to our best players .... Bart or Webster. Does it matter.... do we have good leadership on the pitch already?

Chambers does not need to be in the team, he could be Club Captain like Bam Bam was and not neccasarily have to be team captain. Fist pumps can be achieved from the bench, too.

Getting distracted from the result and it's not all about Chambo. But does Chambers need to be put out of his misery so he can concentrate on improving his football. Being a proper bloke only goes so far.

Good result.... strange performance, but at least a result like this might mean we can go into the next game with a bit of positivity. Glad to see the strikers on the score-sheet, too.

For the most part, I am getting too disinterested in Town to have much of an opinion and make any comments.
The comments above strike a chord with me, though, but I feel they do not make the point strongly enough.
I have said it before, and I'll keep saying it until maybe it really does happen..........we will never be a consistently good team as long as we continue to play Chambers, Berra, and Skuse. They all need not just dropping, but being kept out of the team permanently.

[herforder]

Great match reports. To grab an away victory from the jaws of what seemed an almost certain defeat, and to come from behind whilst scoring three goals (albeit one a dubious pen), would appear a notable achievement, if taken in isolation from the overall performance. But the 3 points gained are vital; I think MM's comments now starting to acknowledge that we're at best a mid to lower outfit, and such victories may well be critical to our survival. The sense of relief, and perhaps disbelief!, was apparent in his post match spouting. Many supporters have reached that conclusion!

Two valid points made by A Mathie, reflecting on the inexplicable collapse following Wigan's equaliser were, firstly, that we do not have enough 'leaders' in the team - too many players went hiding, either through dramatic drops in confidence, or fear of making mistakes. Players that should have been demanding the ball, affecting the game and believing that we could re-impose our game. Second point, which is something we already know, is that there is a quality gap within the squad, which only investment will help address. Of course we have some very promising young lads coming through, but not yet ready or able to withstand the rigours of the
C'ship week in, week out - especially in a struggling team. But then, some of our more experienced and seniors need to look at their own performances, and ability to cope with pressure.

[Bluemike]

Spot on about players hiding Herforder and at times this season Bru, Ward, Sears & Bishop have done just that although Bishop can't be counted as a leader by any means but these are the players that need to be expressing themselves more. Whatever people may or may not say about Jonathon Douglas he does not hide, his legs may have gone but he is honest and yet still gets dogs abuse where others don't so much. Same with Chambo, and while I feel we do have a better option he will never hide even when getting ripped apart like yesterday, I just struggle to understand why some players are pretty exempt from much criticism at all (Sears) while others get it every week.

[herforder]

Yes, part of MM's consistent mantra is that, although we might not be blessed with the most talented bunch, to a man they never give less than 100%, would die in ditches for each other, and don't know when they're beaten. As you say, this rings a bit hollow with some of 'em, whilst those who are invariably 'honest', but maybe not the most accomplished, get the brunt of criticsm and abuse. Funny old game, ain't it?! One thing is pretty obvious, is that overall confidence and belief is very fragile.

[marko69]

Just managed to catch some highlights. Surprised it wasn't abandoned. Everyone must've been struggling to see near the end. Looked like a typical Arbroath v East Fife game with the North Sea Haar!

[arana peligrosa]

Good enough didn't think the team would get anything from this trip let alone score three goals but that was a score that would have caught many by surprise. Bialkowski played a pivotal part at times in the victory and earned his salary but the need for attacking additions is still a necessity regardless of what occurred.

Bear in mind all this against an opposition that are on a downward spiral and may well find themselves in League One by seasons end but the most important aspect of it all is the three points and a run of games ahead that are winnable. Rarely subscribe to the "we're so many points from the play-off zone" side of it after any win - the greater concern could be keeping attention on the other end of the league - but once again the team are arguably too inconsistent to expect anything other than another season in the championship league. In any event those that traveled would have been witness to something where certain positives could be taken away and hopefully subsequent games against opposition that are beatable can bring further points to the campaign.

[Charnwood]

Thanks for the reports from Bluemike & Mach which always make a good read especially so soon after the game.

With a game that many expected to be goalless I guess 5 was an unexpected treat especially when we scored 3 of them. Not bad for a team that had only scored 5 in their 10 previous away games played so far this season.

Just hope you were at the right end of the ground to see them.

All the best for Christmas boys, keep the reports coming we all really appreciate it.

[phily bon bon]

Like Rossi i dont really comment much, a Little disillusioned to be honest. I fully expect a defeat NeXT time round and I doubt we will win two games in a row this year. In fact i expect a religation battle ahead though hope Im wrong.

Some will say we are´nt that far off the play offs which is try ,but we are not a million miles away from the bottom three either. Its a tight League and though we seem to always have a good or fair Christmas this could go horibly wrong.

I was delighted to see an attacking side named and Mick going for it for a change, it remains to be seen if hes as brave in a few weeks time, Knudsen coming back was a kick in the teeth but he crossed well for the goal ,and chambers (not because of one game) needs to be taking out of the spotlight.

[marko69]

Text this morning from wee cousin......, "Hope Ipswich haven't used up any luck they have left with that penalty decision! That was bloody hilarious mate!"

[phily bon bon]

Btw Saint Jude WTF ???MADrid

[marko69]

Btw Saint Jude WTF ???MADrid

HA! Go check my post on December 3rd in the "Changes to the forum" thread, PBB!

[ashfordblue]

the test will come against Fulham, who have been mighty impressive of late and Brizzle City, who are again in up and down form, but until MM gets a more settled constructive side in place the results will go against us, he is too defensive minded, which allows teams to come at us down our weak flanks of Knudsen and Chambers, and until we get this sorted once and for all, we will struggle big time, and ME needs to fund Mick properly, get rid of the secondary players dross we have on the books, and start pushing the likes of Kenlock, Emmanuel, Benyu, and Dozzell to the fore on a more regular basis, to team up with Williams, Webster, Ward, Pitman, Didsie, Lawrence, these are the future, not the has been players currently trying to perform.

[Andym]

I've taken time to add to this thread, largely because I wasn't at the game and only form any opinion based on Radio Suffolk's commentary and the reports on this forum.

Although I understand Bluemike's comments about the positive feelings when the team was announced, and would agree to some extent, it was possibly this that caused us to be outplayed by a struggling team for large parts of the game.

We all wanted changes. Possibly 4 at once (Knudsen was hardly a change) was too many. We see it every year with the cup games; a lot of changes and we do not play as a team. (If we ever do..)

I think Dozzell needs to be introduced as a sub for 20 minutes or so for a few games rather than started. But I guess he'll be out the team again now. The young players need to be introduced into a stable line up, given a run of 3 or 4 games. But that's not MMs way.

But the biggest problem is the formation. And our lack of options in key areas.

Our fullbacks are, by most people's admissions, poor. Whether the youngsters are any better is open to debate. The frustration amongst fans is Chambers' and Knudsen's automatic selection. A bigger problem in my opinion is our midfield options. I imagine we weren't far off a 4-1-4-1 formation on Saturday. I know I am overcritical of Skuse but we will never be successful when we play him. Centre midfield requires pace and vision. It requires versatility. It requires a man who will constantly make himself available and demand the ball. Skuse does none of these things. But worryingly we have no alternative. What other midfielder do we have with any sort of defensive brain? Hyam is injured. He has a bit of pace and demands the ball but has no vision. But a fit Hyam has to be a better option than Skuse. Until then we have no one.

I am assuming from the commentary that Sears played wide right. So our right hand side consisted of a striker who doesn't really understand how to defend and a centre back who has proved he struggles at fullback repeatedly. Is it any wonder we got torn apart down that side? Why didn't MM either replace Chambers or bring Ward on sooner who might have offered a bit more cover?

Pitman is not and never will be a target man / lone striker. Why was McGoldrick dropped? I thought he had been one of our better players lately. Otherwise we seem to have so few options for changing things where it matters. It's going to be very difficult to turn this around and avoid a relegation fight.

[marko69]

Can only assume, regarding your last paragraph, Andy, that maybe McGoldrick (tendency not to always be match sharp) was intentionally left as a quality set of fresh legs for later in the game. Proved to be decisive in my opinion.

[phily bon bon]

I saw it Marko in your reference above. Still believe Mick has no idea of his best side and whom to play where on the pitch. He blindly stays faithful to players way out of form,thiugh I dont believe in chopping and changing daily i think that to shake Things up and keep players on their toes is only a good thing(not getting too comfortable)

I expect to get maybe one point from our next two matches unfourtunately.



I hope Im wrong

[Tangfastic]

Chopping and changing team selection is one thing.... and it shows the manager hasn't got the strength to go with his convictions. Mick has that strength of personal conviction, but he's gone way, way beyond that... to the point of blindly showing faith with players who will never take us forward. Honest triers they are... but MM has got himself caught up by loyally backing chosen players and they're not giving back... or just not capable of anything more.

I expect the same back four ( Knudsen won't be dropped after a win and Chambers is undroppable) . Didsy will surely be back in team ... won't he? Kind of expect Douglas or Bru will be back for Williams. If Williams can't get a run in the team, then send him back to Palace.

Mick could really do himself - and Chambers - a favour by dropping Chambers. That's a big statement and a bit of humble pie for Mick, but it gets all this 'undroppable' side-issue out of the way all in one go. Can't see it happening at all.

[phily bon bon]

Chopping and changing team selection is one thing.... and it shows the manager hasn't got the strength to go with his convictions. Mick has that strength of personal conviction, but he's gone way, way beyond that... to the point of blindly showing faith with players who will never take us forward. Honest triers they are... but MM has got himself caught up by loyally backing chosen players and they're not giving back... or just not capable of anything more.

I expect the same back four ( Knudsen won't be dropped after a win and Chambers is undroppable) . Didsy will surely be back in team ... won't he? Kind of expect Douglas or Bru will be back for Williams. If Williams can't get a run in the team, then send him back to Palace.

Mick could really do himself - and Chambers - a favour by dropping Chambers. That's a big statement and a bit of humble pie for Mick, but it gets all this 'undroppable' side-issue out of the way all in one go. Can't see it happening at all.

Could not agree more but i to dont see this happening. I like a manager not swayed by the fans and strength in his own convictions but plain stubbon and pig headedness is also not the answer, sometimes we all have need to step out of the limelight when Things are´nt going are way for one reason or another.

[hallamblue]

Chopping and changing team selection is one thing.... and it shows the manager hasn't got the strength to go with his convictions. Mick has that strength of personal conviction, but he's gone way, way beyond that... to the point of blindly showing faith with players who will never take us forward. Honest triers they are... but MM has got himself caught up by loyally backing chosen players and they're not giving back... or just not capable of anything more.

I expect the same back four ( Knudsen won't be dropped after a win and Chambers is undroppable) . Didsy will surely be back in team ... won't he? Kind of expect Douglas or Bru will be back for Williams. If Williams can't get a run in the team, then send him back to Palace.

Mick could really do himself - and Chambers - a favour by dropping Chambers. That's a big statement and a bit of humble pie for Mick, but it gets all this 'undroppable' side-issue out of the way all in one go. Can't see it happening at all.

Agree with all if this. MM has made a lot if his own problems I think. Now he has to be prepared to eat a bit if humble pie, and mix it up again for Fulham game. I personally would bring in Kenlock and Emmanuel for Boxing Day game and the rest of them changes he made for the 1st half if Wigan game, with exception of Dozzell - he's simply not up for it yet.